EA Forums

Posted: **Thu Feb 13, 2020 10:08 pm**

Chesleyt (imported) wrote: Thu Feb 13, 2020 8:35 pm I just ordered 2.5 estriol and estradiol cream it's bio identical off Amazon. Do I use it every day? I just want to stay healthy and not feminization. Endocrinologist said no to helping me, so I'm on my own. Were do I find testing and when should I get it done? I want to do this so I can show him that it's working for me and maybe get him convinced to help me.

Somehow I don't think over-the-counter creams from Amazon are going to help you at all. Why not just order real estradiol from an offshore pharmacy?

If you search the internet you'll find a lot of walk-in labs and another internet search will help you determine the appropriate dosing. Alternately do as I plan to do and find another doctor to monitor you. Even though I don't want to transition, a transgender friendly doc will be my choice and again, they can be found on the internet. I am learning that not all transgender people fall into strictly MtF and FtM categories and there are a lot of "gender identities" in between.

However, if you do go on even low dose estrogen you'll have to accept the side effects including decrease of libido, probably goodbye to erections and growing boobs. Like most things in life you don't get something for nothing.

Posted: **Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:00 am**

I don't want my libido back and emotionally I'm finally happy. I just don't want osteoporosis. The information on the site said it was a pharmacy and that it was bio identical. I just want healthy bones. My antidepressants take care of all the other side effects. If I had my choice I would never take hormones ever again. It's not a cream in a bottle it's in a pump like androgel is.

Posted: **Fri Feb 14, 2020 3:39 am**

Chesleyt (imported) wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:00 am I don't want my libido back and emotionally I'm finally happy. I just don't want osteoporosis. The information on the site said it was a pharmacy and that it was bio identical. I just want healthy bones. My antidepressants take care of all the other side effects. If I had my choice I would never take hormones ever again. It's not a cream in a bottle it's in a pump like androgel is.

I'm not a doctor and even though I have stayed in many Holiday Inns (a joke some won't get) I hesitate to offer you advice. However, I personally would be concerned with mixing a potent herbs or vitamins with anti-depressants or any other prescription medicine. Just take care of yourself and do your research.

Eventually we will find doctors to help but 'till then scour the internet paying attention only to legitimate medical sites and not to what some bozo on a forum recommends. Unless that bozo tells you to tread carefully.

Posted: **Fri Feb 14, 2020 3:50 am**

It's made by bio labs and it's not herbal at all it's bio identical estradiol and estradiol. Money back guarantee. It's FDA approved and it's made in a kosher facility. I'm going to try it and I'm looking for a place to get lab work to see if it's working and if it does I'll let you know. I guess I'll be the Guinea pig.

Posted: **Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:34 pm**

Chesleyt (imported) wrote: Fri Feb 14, 2020 3:50 am It's made by bio labs and it's not herbal at all it's bio identical estradiol and estradiol. Money back guarantee. It's FDA approved and it's made in a kosher facility. I'm going to try it and I'm looking for a place to get lab work to see if it's working and if it does I'll let you know. I guess I'll be the Guinea pig.

I've been using it, .25mg, I do two doses at night and two in the AM, 1mg.

Actually works. $30 a bottle though, not sure it works that well, in that it's cheaper to go offshore.

Posted: **Tue Feb 18, 2020 2:51 am**

I'm faced with the same problem. After going a year with very low T and taking estradiol and progesterone, I'm happier than ever and my wife and I have never been happier than ever. But I don't want to keep hiding the fact that I've been taking female hormones so I told my internist the whole story about CaCl2 injections and taking hormones. I told her I didn't want to keep self-medicating. She did eventually refer me to an endocrinologist (female) who took a lot of time listening to my history and I hope she'll eventually get me to where I need to be. But first, I have to go without any hormones, then try low-dose T. I can't imagine that will work, but this is the route I have to take and hope she'll believe me if I report being miserable on even a lot dose of T. If not, then I'll have to decide whether to keep looking for a sympathetic physician or go back on the female hormones.

I'm also thinking about whether there are any other means of influencing the medical community to take us seriously. We're really being pioneers in this regard and pushing this particular boundary may end up benefiting millions of men like us who don't understand whey they are so miserable.

Posted: **Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:27 pm**

notsomanly (imported) wrote: Tue Feb 18, 2020 2:51 am I'm faced with the same problem. After going a year with very low T and taking estradiol and progesterone, I'm happier than ever and my wife and I have never been happier than ever. But I don't want to keep hiding the fact that I've been taking female hormones so I told my internist the whole story about CaCl2 injections and taking hormones. I told her I didn't want to keep self-medicating. She did eventually refer me to an endocrinologist (female) who took a lot of time listening to my history and I hope she'll eventually get me to where I need to be. But first, I have to go without any hormones, then try low-dose T. I can't imagine that will work, but this is the route I have to take and hope she'll believe me if I report being miserable on even a lot dose of T. If not, then I'll have to decide whether to keep looking for a sympathetic physician or go back on the female hormones.

I'm also thinking about whether there are any other means of influencing the medical community to take us seriously. We're really being pioneers in this regard and pushing this particular boundary may end up benefiting millions of men like us who don't understand whey they are so miserable.

Influencing the USA or UK medical community will be a task akin to flying to the moon in a home-made rocket. No other profession seems to be as intransigent and stubborn and all changes so far have come very slowly. I hate it, for I'm not a big fan of self medicating but just like doctors drive Eunuch wannabes to self mutilate or to underground "cutters", they drive cross hormone seekers to offshore pharmacies. To me this is absurd and counterproductive. I also note the hypocrisy of a profession whose manta is "do no harm".

Posted: **Wed Feb 19, 2020 12:27 am**

seanthomas (imported) wrote: Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:27 pm Influencing the USA or UK medical community will be a task akin to flying to the moon in a home-made rocket. No other profession seems to be as intransigent and stubborn and all changes so far have come very slowly. I hate it, for I'm not a big fan of self medicating but just like doctors drive Eunuch wannabes to self mutilate or to underground "cutters", they drive cross hormone seekers to offshore pharmacies. To me this is absurd and counterproductive. I also note the hypocrisy of a profession whose manta is "do no harm".

I totally agree. So many of us have had so many problems over all these years.

Posted: **Wed Feb 19, 2020 9:16 am**

seanthomas (imported) wrote: Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:27 pm Influencing the USA or UK medical community will be a task akin to flying to the moon in a home-made rocket. No other profession seems to be as intransigent and stubborn and all changes so far have come very slowly. I hate it, for I'm not a big fan of self medicating but just like doctors drive Eunuch wannabes to self mutilate or to underground "cutters", they drive cross hormone seekers to offshore pharmacies. To me this is absurd and counterproductive. I also note the hypocrisy of a profession whose manta is "do no harm".

I guess I take hope from the fact that transgender, in fact the whole spectrum of LGTBQ is now considered legitimate by the medical community. But it did take a long time. And there seem to be relatively few of us who just want to be rid of that infernal hormone and nothing else.

Posted: **Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:43 pm**

notsomanly (imported) wrote: Wed Feb 19, 2020 9:16 am I guess I take hope from the fact that transgender, in fact the whole spectrum of LGTBQ is now considered legitimate by the medical community. But it did take a long time. And there seem to be relatively few of us who just want to be rid of that infernal hormone and nothing else.

I have been casually looking online for a doctor in my area that deals with transgenders to supervise should I wish to continue estrogen in June. I think I have been "fishing in the wrong pond" when it comes to finding a hormone doctor, as they must be out there serving the trans community. So maybe it's not as difficult as I first imagined and I simply need to find the right pond in which to fish.

Posted: **Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:45 am**

seanthomas (imported) wrote: Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:43 pm I have been casually looking online for a doctor in my area that deals with transgenders to supervise should I wish to continue estrogen in June. I think I have been "fishing in the wrong pond" when it comes to finding a hormone doctor, as they must be out there serving the trans community. So maybe it's not as difficult as I first imagined and I simply need to find the right pond in which to fish.

I certainly found it much easier to find service providers and explain myself to them when I understood and accepted that I was nonbinary, and thus a type of transgender. We have many needs in common with the MtF community, some of whom are here.

Posted: **Thu Feb 20, 2020 10:46 am**

catoboros (imported) wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:45 am I certainly found it much easier to find service providers and explain myself to them when I understood and accepted that I was nonbinary, and thus a type of transgender. We have many needs in common with the MtF community, some of whom are here.

It would be great if I could say that I'm nonbinary, but I'm not. The biggest hurdle may be to get the medical community to understand that some cis males just don't like the effects of testosterone that most men (and doctors) see as essential to maleness.

Posted: **Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:00 am**

I've been off testosterone for 6 weeks and feel great but know that I need some hormones but I have severe reaction to synthetic testosterone. It causes sever mental problems with my bipolar disorder and skitzoaffectine disorder, it causes my medications to stop working. Off testosterone I'm doing great even my counselor has noticed a big change in me. I see my psychiatrist the beginning of the month and will be talking to him about it. I don't know if he can help me? I know women who have mental disorders can be affected by hormones. I will have to see.

I will be talking about estrogen therapy and how it's used in prostate cancer patients, so I can show him that it's used in men in low doses.

Posted: **Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:18 am**

notsomanly (imported) wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 10:46 am It would be great if I could say that I'm nonbinary, but I'm not. The biggest hurdle may be to get the medical community to understand that some cis males just don't like the effects of testosterone that most men (and doctors) see as essential to maleness.

Dare I say that in their mind, that is non-binary! I had to go that route also to get what I wanted.

Posted: **Fri Feb 21, 2020 9:12 am**

notsomanly (imported) wrote: Thu Feb 20, 2020 10:46 am It would be great if I could say that I'm nonbinary, but I'm not. The biggest hurdle may be to get the medical community to understand that some cis males just don't like the effects of testosterone that most men (and doctors) see as essential to maleness.

Here is an interesting idea: can a cis man suffer from gender dysphoria?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_dysphoria

I have always thought that gender dysphoria is the strongest sign of a trans gender identity (binary and nonbinary), but if someone identifies as a cis man and their conception of their cis man gender identity is different to that commonly held by other cis men and their gender identity assigned at birth, then surely that meets the criteria of a mismatch? Gender dysphoria is (DSM-5) is important as a descriptive tool because it is often used for service gatekeeping.

A related issue are trans people who feel a strong desire to transition, including those who do transition, without reporting any gender dysphoria. I think this is another example where providers can put different labels on things without requiring people to adopt particular labels for themselves.

So, in a nutshell, you may gender dysphoria even though you identify as a cis man.

Posted: **Fri Feb 21, 2020 6:15 pm**

I've had good luck using www.alldaychemist.com to buy estrogen. It's much cheaper ($4/month) though if you have a prescription. Just make sure it's estrodiol and not Premarin or other non bioidentical.

Posted: **Sat Feb 22, 2020 11:04 am**

I have concerns that the medical establishment I visit will react negatively if I come out as trans. They refused to even consider castration when I asked for it. They don't understand. Even if I had a therapist write a letter I suspect they would be concerned about what the insurance would think (Which is why they have not put me on low dose E yet).

It's a sad state in this country.

Posted: **Wed Feb 26, 2020 7:49 am**

catoboros (imported) wrote: Fri Feb 21, 2020 9:12 am Here is an interesting idea: can a cis man suffer from gender dysphoria?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_dysphoria

I have always thought that gender dysphoria is the strongest sign of a trans gender identity (binary and nonbinary), but if someone identifies as a cis man and their conception of their cis man gender identity is different to that commonly held by other cis men and their gender identity assigned at birth, then surely that meets the criteria of a mismatch? Gender dysphoria is (DSM-5) is important as a descriptive tool because it is often used for service gatekeeping.

A related issue are trans people who feel a strong desire to transition, including those who do transition, without reporting any gender dysphoria. I think this is another example where providers can put different labels on things without requiring people to adopt particular labels for themselves.

So, in a nutshell, you may gender dysphoria even though you identify as a cis man.

Interesting point of view - thanks. Whatever my gender, I haven't felt any different about it since ditching T. I just feel way better, more connective with others and the parts of me that I always liked the best and are now so dominant and constitute what I now see as my true self.

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