EA Forums

I am officially a eunuch as of 11/18/08!! My means of becoming a eunuch took much different track then most in this forum but I do want to explain what happened and to emphasize that even a simple orchiectomy can become a nightmare.

4 years ago I had a left sided inguinal orchiectomy due to urine refluxing into my testicle and it slowly killed the testicle over a period of 6 years. This resulted in unbearable pain. I asked to doc to take it out and instead he sent me to a pain doctor. Pain doc prescribed Topamax and Effexor. While the drugs did work to control the pain the Topamax turned me into a mentally clouded useless state. I was totally unable to function and I lost my ability to remember or come up with words while talking. Also the Effexor made me gain around 60lbs. I finally DEMANDED that the doc take out the testicle. So 4 years ago I became a 1/2 eunuch. No one knew at the time that I was taking Spiro and that I had really had the desire to go all the way.

After the first orchiectomy I began taking Spiro and then Androcur for about 4years and the results were amazing. Desire disappeared along with erections and most of the body hair on my chest, belly, arm pits and legs became peach fuzz. The only thing I did not like was the loss of energy. That was tough.

Fast forward 4 years and I went to the doctor for an annual checkup. Everything was fine but the doctor discovered an unusual finding in my remaining testicle. Cancer was the diagnosis and I was scheduled for surgery about a week later. I was so excited that I was going to become a eunuch but I was also scared of what treatments were in store for me to cure the cancer.

The doctor began the inguinal orchiectomy and when he examined the mass it it did not look like cancer. So he sent it to a pathologist who discovered the mass inside my testicle was nothing but dead tissue. The official diagnosis was a "Testicular Segmental Infarction". So 1/2 of the testicle was removed and I was put back together.

I was excited it was NOT cancer and there would be no need for radiation, chemo ect. But I was also disappointed that I still had 1/2 of a testicle and I was not a eunuch.

About 2 weeks after the surgery my T-level dropped to 30. I ended up having so little energy that I did not have enough strength to do much of anything. The doc did some tests and found that the testicle had stopped functioning and it would probably shrink up and die. I began using Androgel because I needed the energy to recover from the surgery.

About 3 months later my 1/2 testicle became infected and blew up to the size of a tangerine. An ultrasound declared that it was a massive infection and the chances of it recovering and working again was very slim. I was loaded up with antibiotics and pain pills and sent home. Then the infection spread to my entire urinary tract. I was really sick and the doc wanted to hospitalize me and do IV antibiotics to try to salvage what was left. I refused. I told him the only reason I would go into a hospital was to remove the testicle. Of course he refused removing it saying that one infection is not worthy of removal.

So the infection did clear up with the oral antibiotics yet it was still the size of a golf ball and was very tender to the touch.

3 weeks later the testicle become infected again. This time it blew up to the size of a large lemon. When the doc examined it he said "This is horrible we might need to take this out". I was once again excited to become a eunuch but my hopes were dashed when he decided to try antibiotics again to see if it would clear up. After a week of antibiotics it became even more infected. I had fever, chills, etc. So then I demanded that he take it out.

It took a very intense discussion with the doctor but in the end he agreed to take it out. His rationale for not taking it out was the tiny chance that maybe it would heal up enough and my fertility could return if I decided to father a child. I have no desire to father a child so my decision was quite easy. The doc really did not want to do the surgery.

The surgery turned into a nightmare. The testicle had fused itself to the scrotum from the infection. If I had waited another few days it probably would have fully infected the scrotum and turned in gangrene. It took the doctor 2 hours to separate the scrotum from the testicle. I awoke to intense pain and was pumped full of narcotics to try to calm it down. What was supposed to be a simple day surgery turned into 2 days in the hospital with major narcotics and IV antibiotics. I never felt pain like that. It was so far beyond my pain threshold that I shook intensely trying to deal with the pain.

I'm home now and while the testicle is definately gone the scrotum is very swollen and looks like there still is a nut in there. The doc inserted a penrose drain in the scrotum to let it drain the blood and whatever. And it drains a lot.

It feels very strange to walk with nothing between your legs. I know I will get used to it but it is strange.

I plan on continuing the Androgel until I have healed up completely. I need the energy from the Androgel to heal. Then I will slowly lower the dose and see how low I can go so that I don't destroy my bones but also achieve the goal I seek.

So while I did eventually achieve my goal of becoming a eunuch it sure was a long, difficult, painful way of getting there.

For those of you who are still intact I suggest you make sure you do a self testicular exam for cancer. You never know what you might end up with.

I'll report back later on my progress.

I hope you get some relief soon and do take care of yourself.

Thanks for sharing this.

Congrats on achieving your goal

Hope you get well soon

Welcome to the EA family. Thank you for sharing your struggles with us. I hope you remain infection free and continue to heal. Keep us posted on your progress.

HI! i dont have any balls either..... Hell none of us do... well some do but we dont hold it against them.

Follow up. It has been 1 week since my orchiectomy. The doc removed the penrose drain yesterday. The hole from the drain is still draining quite a bit of blood and I hope that it seals up soon. Also there is one spot in the stitches where blood leaks quite a bit. The doc said to give it another week and if it is still bleeding he would cauterize it.

Even though the scrotum is empty it still looks and feels as though there is a small testicle in there. It feels like a triangular mass but in reality it is just blood and puss that has hardened up. The doc said it would take months to completely resolve and then it would be empty.

Hormone effects have not changed at all as I will continue taking Androgel until I am fully healed.

As I mentioned before it is very strange to walk around

bfleish (imported) wrote: Sun Nov 23, 2008 2:06 pm with nothing between your legs. I know I will get used to it but it is

noticeably different. I didn't think about this before the surgery so I was not prepared.

I hope that my scrotum shrinks up quite a bit. I have a feeling that it may become really loose when warmer weather comes and it will stick to my thigh. I asked the doc if it could be trimmed up if I didn't like it. He thought that was a very strange question but said it could be done in a separate surgery.

The pain is almost gone but the itching from the stitches and the "haircut" I got down there is not fun at all.

I'll report back when the sack is empty and what decisions I make on reducing the Androgel.

Thank you for all your support.

bfleish,

When you decide to stop the Androgel, do so slowly if possible and consider using low dose compounded testosterone in its place. If you go off Androgel too quickly, you might nose dive into deep depression. I would also suggest experimenting with low dose testosterone, try to find out where you feel comfortable. I can't go below about 120 or I become extremely fatigued with no motivation and with depression. Do what's best for you. Hash

Sorry you had all that run around with the doctor. I know they mean well but yeouch... Anyway for anyone else reading this I would suggest you always be upfront and honest with your doctor. You may think they will flip out of their pants if you spell out your needs but its better then having them guess and screwing around.

Sorry to hear the non hormone you is underpowered. I started that way and life really sucked until I went on Androgel. Its no crime to appreciate the energy and mood improvments that HRT gives you. GOOD LUCK!!!:)

bfleish,

Out of curiosity, was all the testicular problems due to self-harm? I've had a lot of similar sort of issues, but all due to damage caused by self-harm. It seems unusual to me that you'd get all these sort of problems naturally. Just curious.

SD

SplitDik,

None of the testicular problems were caused by self harm. I had been diagnosed with an inherited form of megacystis 25 years ago which probably caused the problems with my left testicle. As far as the right testicle the diagnosis of cancer was a total shock to me. But when the diagnosis came back as an infarction the megacystis could have caused that too.

Yep, viral damage here as well. Just a different type and put up with the aches and pains and low to no T just a tad longer. Pretty dumb to not have put my foot down long ago but... What can I say.

Welcome to the Flatbaggers Club. Don't worry. You already paid your dues!

I did a little test this Thanksgiving weekend out of total curiosity.

First the doc took out the drain last Tuesday and I had hoped that the draining would stop soon after. Boy was I wrong. It still drains a few tablespoons of blood/lymph daily. The open skin drain requires a full roll of gauze which get saturated every day. I was using an elastic brief gizmo that the hospital gave me but after almost 2 weeks of usage and washing it in the sink it started to fall apart. Regular briefs and boxer briefs wouldn't hold the gauze in the right place so blood would run down my leg and get on my socks and shoes. So yesterday I purchased some jockstraps. The jockstraps are a perfect fit, holds the gauze right were it should be and oh so sexy (at least for some of you).

On to my experiment.

Since it was Thanksgiving Weekend and I knew that everyone would think I would be an invalid from having surgery and they wouldn't let me do anything. I decided to see how long I could go without taking the Androgel.

The last time I used the Androgel was Tuesday 11/25/08. Wed, Thur, Fri, & Sat I noticed nothing.

Sunday was completely different. I woke up feeling like i had the flu but had no fever. I woke up around 8:00am but felt so bad I rolled over and slept until 12:00. At noon I CRAWLED out of bed and barely had the energy to go down the stairs to feed the cats and my self. After a bowl of Raisin Bran I crawled back up the stairs and went back to bed. I slept until 4:00pm At 4:00pm I realized that the lack of testosterone was the reason for having no energy and that I needed to end this experiment and get back on the Androgel.

I decided to take a shower first. Washing my hair was pure hell. I would scrub for a few seconds and then rest by leaning against the wall. The shower took so long that I ran out of hot water. Once the shower was done I applied the Androgel and rested for about an hour.

After an hour I felt pretty good. I did laundry, cleaned up the house, worked on a computer problem etc. and now I feel just fine.

So the experiment taught this eunuch the following:

After 5 days without Androgel I've got a problem.

After 5 days without Androgel my energy levels plummet extremely fast.

Once I take the Androgel again it only takes about an hour for my body to get working again.

I don't think I will ever be able to stop the Androgel completely. I think it will take quite a bit of experimenting to find the dose that is low enough to my liking yet keeps my energy levels at an acceptable level.

While I am glad I did this experiment I don't need to do it again. I really felt awful Sunday and I have no need to get there again.

I find it interesting that I took spiro/androcur for 4 years back when I had one testicle and I never felt as bad as I felt this morning. I guess it did not block everything.

For me there was subtle changes earlier then 5 days. My mood started going bad in a couple of days. I was "snippy" and no fun to be around. My mental clarity also took a hike pretty fast. Not fun...

It all seemed normal at first but others clued me in "Whats wrong with you ASS&^%$!?" Subtle huh? But I think its difficult for us to see ourselves.

Well as my doctor told me. I have to tell you that you are probably going to need this for the rest of your life. To me? RELIEF! It just sucked without it....

Two week followup:

After two weeks post orchiectomy the pain is mostly gone. If I have been sitting in a chair for a long time it gets sore but a couple Advil takes care of it.

I saw the doc today and he said everything looks good. There still is a hard part inside the scrotum that is the size of a medium but kind of flat testicle. The doc said it was a hematoma and it would eventually shrink up and go away. I expressed my frustration with the drainage hole draining 2-3 tablespoons of blood/lymph every day and needing to use lots of gauze and wearing a jockstrap to hold the gauze in place is a pain to deal with.

He told me that if he sealed up the hole all the blood and lymph would have nowhere to go and my scrotum would swell up to a huge size. Then he would have to use a syringe to drain it all away. He said when it stops draining the hole will seal up on its own.

I hate it when doctors are right.

I am still very happy to be a eunuch and I absolutely know I did right thing. I am not sure what I am going to do with the Androgel. Right now I am taking 10gm's a day. I really enjoy the energy it gives me. Also my mind/memory seems so much sharper than when I was taking Spiro & Androcur. I think I'm going to keep taking the same dose for a while and when it feels right I will experiment with taking lower doses. I definately know that I will never

bfleish (imported) wrote: Mon Dec 01, 2008 2:23 pm stop the Androgel completely.

When my T-level was at 30 life was impossible.

On a strange side note my wonderful health insurance turned down paying the Anesthesiology bill stating that an orchiectomy does not require anesthesia. What do you think?

All I can say is... Umm, What?!? Btw, congrats on the healing!

Ash

Two week followup:

bfleish (imported) wrote: Wed Dec 03, 2008 2:15 pm On a strange side note my wonderful health insurance turned down paying the Anesthesiology bill stating that an orchiectomy does not require anesthesia. What do you think?

bfleish (imported) wrote: Wed Dec 03, 2008 2:15 pm On a strange side note my wonderful health insurance turned down paying the Anesthesiology bill stating that an orchiectomy does not require anesthesia. What do you think?

Your surgeon needs to write them a Doctors override but WHY? I'm not sure. I had a General and was out like a light. The Doctor talked to me about doing other forms but he said that he needed me to be "out"

Maybe I talk too much?

bfleish,

Sorry to hear about your post-op problems but the Doc is right, they will disappear and the swelling will go down. Fortunately, I had no swelling or drainage from my orchiectomy. The Doc did both sides through the scrotum and there was very little swelling and no drainage. I kept it iced down pretty good for a while tho.

My insurance did not have a problem with paying for the anesthesia and as others said, the doc wanted me out even tho I requested to be awake for the operation. He said that the local would only deaden the area from the inguinal canal down to the scrotum and when he pulled on the cords to remove as much as possible, the pain would radiate up in to the abdomen and may cause me to "heave" during the operation. He did not want to deal with the possibility.

I am sure your doctor had similar valid reasons. A letter from him to the insurance company should resolve the issue.

Good luck on the healing process and in dealing with the insurance company.

JLC9292

I spoke to the surgeon today about the insurance company turning down the anesthesia part of the bill. His quote was "I HATE (Insert Insurance Company Name Here)". It seems that they turn down anesthesia for lots of urological procedures. He transferred me to his insurance person who sounded like she knew exactly what to do because she's done it lots of times. I am really hopeful that things will get straightened out.

Question. Insurance paid the surgeon $350.00 for the scrotal orchiectomy. It took him over 2 hours to do the orchiectomy because there was quite a bit of work separating the testicle from the scrotum due to the infection. He told me it was very difficult due to the vascular and nerve supply in the scrotum. If I had been conscious when he discovered how difficult it was to separate them I would have voted for removing the scrotum at the same time. But I never got to vote (although I did vote in the last election). For the first time ever I feel as though the surgeon didn't get paid enough. What do you think?

On a humorous note when the anesthesiologist injected the happy juice and then I was wheeled off to the OR the anesthesiologist started telling the most outrageous, hilarious, fall on the floor laughing castration jokes. Everyone including myself was laughing out loud. Then the anesthesiologist said to me "Good thing you won't remember any of these jokes because the drugs will make you forget them". I guess the Versed didn't work. "What did the penis say to the empty scrotum? Hey Buzz where did Woody go? I seemed to have lost him"

Almost 3 week post orchichiectomy followup:

I'm not doing so well right now. I seek your help. In the last few days my energy has plummeted and I feel like I'm crashing.

I am currently on 10grams of Androgel and am taking it at the same time every day. I am also taking 400mg of Ibuprophen 2 or 3 times a day for pain and swelling which is really is not so bad. The drain hole from the penrose drain has sealed up almost completely and drains maybe 5-6 drops of lymph a day on a 1x1 guaze pad taped to my scrotum with paper tape. I have no fever that I know of (I guess there might be a little but I don't feel cold or fevery). My scrotum is still a swollen a little but nothing out of the ordinary and I am still wearing a jockstrap which really helps with the swelling and the pain. (For those who get an Inguinal or Scrotal orchiectomy I strongly recommend wearing a jockstrap. Not comfortable at all but it definately helps with swelling and pain. Well worth it.)

My problem is extreme fatigue. For example last night I went to sleep around 11:00pm and slept very deeply until almost noon today. When I awoke I was totally out of it and ate a light breakfast while watching the Football game. During half time I fell asleep in the chair and slept until the game was over. I got up and changed the sheets on the bed and began laundry. After changing the sheets I was exhausted. I crawled into bed and slept hard until 6:00pm. I managed to finish laundry and sat down to eat a diner (I thought protein might help so I ate a steak). Yep, sound asleep in the chair until 8:00pm Right now all I can think about is crawling back in bed and sleeping.

This is pretty much a repeat of what happened yesterday. I was so frustrated because I really needed to solve a problem on a Server (SBS 2008 for you geeks) and I kept nodding off while sitting at my desk and then I would crawl into bed and sleep for hours.

My theories:

My body is still healing from the orchiectomy. But it has been almost 3 weeks and it was was just a scrotal orchiectomy.

My body is still healing from the massive infection that fused the testicle and scrotum together and created a nightmare for the surgeon to remove the testicle. As a result the scrotum is still healing and my body is wearing me out attempting to clear out the infection (I found out from the urologist that while I was in the hospital for 2 days they gave me 14 different IV antibiotics to try and clear up the infection.)

The Androgel is either not being absorbed correctly or is not enough. I plan on geting this checked ASAP.

I've got some other bug in me that is making me tired. Since I've not "participated" since the surgery I doubt it would be mononeucleosis.

I'm just getting old and tired.

Someone switched the Advil with some really powerful downers.

Any other suggestions? I seek your wisdom. I really hate this feeling and I've got to get working again.

Infection still going on? Perhaps an MSRA infection? Especially after 14 antibiotics - something was hard core. Blood test time. MSRA's can be very virulent, stubborn, difficult to cure, long-lasting, and can get deadly if not controlled. Worth checking out.

Androgel does not work for everyone. Perhaps your body is not accepting it. Maybe try injectable. T-tests will help tell.

Consider the notion of depression. You've gone through a great trauma, regardless of need, intention, or desire. Depression IS a common concern post castration. Consider it. Massive sleeping is a classic indication of depression.

Anything else, consult your doctors....

Something esle is up if you are doing that much androgel , and still feel tired. I also question you still having drainage issues this long after surgery.

I had two orchiectomies a month apart , on Oct 7th, and November 7th , and am totally healed up. No swelling, no pains , and no drainage, since about the 5th day after.

You need to get to the Doc for some blood work. Must be a systemic infection.

Ray

I'd guess that infection is dragging you down. As for the drainage, mine didn't quit until day 42 or 43.

A couple of Androgel tips. It must be "rubbed" in. If you see a white frost after it dries you didn't rub hard enough. Think almost massage - your not frosting a cake.

Its almost worthless if you rub it on hair. So, if your belly and shoulders are hairy? Shave or use Nair for men and get bare so it can work.

Don't get creative and apply it to other areas.

Infections are MAJOR bad news. Be proactive and scream to your doctor!

Everyone,

Thank you so much for your replies. This really is a special place and the support is the best!!!

The doc hit the nail on the head on what was making me so darn sleepy. The only reason he knew what was wrong was that he had another patient who experienced the same problem. I'll try to keep it brief:

The problem was a drug interaction with 2 drugs when taken at the same time. I am taking a statin (My cholesterol is just fine but my father died at 60 with terrible vascular disease so I've been taking it preventively for years) and a very low dose hypertensive drug for the same reason. I had just switched the statin drug to the generic because you can get 6 months worth at Costco for $16.00 (and 6 months of the hypertensive drug for $18.00). I don't want to say the names of the drugs (don't need lawyer's caroling at my door right now) but when you take them at the same time they interact (at least with me) and turned me into a sleeping zombie.

The doc suggested stopping the Statin drug till I felt better and then taking the statin in the evening and the hypertenstive drug in the morning and see how that does.

He was still concerned that there might still be an infection so they stole some of my blood (and they even charged me for stealing it) and he wrote a script for an antibiotic just in case.

The drainage from the drain hole is essentially gone. I would say it is maybe a drop or two a day. No more gauze and paper tape!!!

As for what MRT mentioned about applying Androgel. Here is how I do it. At $18/day I try to maximize my dosage. I put on vinyl gloves first. Androgel will not stick to vinyl but sticks to skin very well. I use the tubes instead of the pump. I squirt one tube into my left gloved hand and smear all of it on my right upper arm, shoulder and chest. I rub until the glove runs into friction. That means all the Androgel has been rubbed in or has evaporated. We're talking maybe 20 seconds. Then I repeat with my right hand. When I'm done I take off the gloves and put the empty tubes inside the gloves and tie it off. This way my curious cats can't (or at least they don't) bite into the empty tubes of Androgel in the trash can. The best part is that I don't have to wash my hands when I'm done!!

So my next quandary as the swelling goes down is boxers or briefs? I'm not into commando, sorry. Opinions?

bfleish (imported) wrote: Thu Dec 04, 2008 12:25 pm I spoke to the surgeon today about the insurance company turning down the anesthesia part of the bill. His quote was "I HATE (Insert Insurance Company Name Here)". It seems that they turn down anesthesia for lots of urological procedures. He transferred me to his insurance person who sounded like she knew exactly what to do because she's done it lots of times. I am really hopeful that things will get straightened out.

Question. Insurance paid the surgeon $350.00 for the scrotal orchiectomy. It took him over 2 hours to do the orchiectomy because there was quite a bit of work separating the testicle from the scrotum due to the infection. He told me it was very difficult due to the vascular and nerve supply in the scrotum. If I had been conscious when he discovered how difficult it was to separate them I would have voted for removing the scrotum at the same time. But I never got to vote (although I did vote in the last election). For the first time ever I feel as though the surgeon didn't get paid enough. What do you think?

On a humorous note when the anesthesiologist injected the happy juice and then I was wheeled off to the OR the anesthesiologist started telling the most outrageous, hilarious, fall on the floor laughing castration jokes. Everyone including myself was laughing out loud. Then the anesthesiologist said to me "Good thing you won't remember any of these jokes because the drugs will make you forget them". I guess the Versed didn't work. "What did the penis say to the empty scrotum? Hey Buzz where did Woody go? I seemed to have lost him"

Ahh your talking about the Milk of Amnesia which didn't work at least one of several times that I was operated on. Odd!