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Earlier today I looked at the "New Posts" section and it lead to a link on the Jokes etc board. This particular one was a funny on the politics of Howard Dean ( a name no-one outside the USA knows anyway, now).

The content of the joke contained displayed an anti Canadian side swipe.

I loathe humour which is used to hide or mask hostile feelings and reactions.

Comedy should be a vehicle to make you laugh and lighten your heart, it should never be used to laugh "at a group". Among close friends we can use humour to "laugh at ourselves" and that is very different.

Please drop the term "anything goes" and better still for the integrity of this excellent site, please remove this scar on our face.

A hyperlink to a joke website can be made and more importantly the chatroom can be a great place for shared fun and laughter amongst ourselves and on theme.

I am asking that the Jokes Section be removed. Do you agree?

Sac_mec (imported) wrote: Wed Jan 14, 2004 1:00 am Earlier today I looked at the "New Posts" section and it lead to a link on the Jokes etc board. This particular one was a funny on the politics of Howard Dean ( a name no-one outside the USA knows anyway, now).

The content of the joke contained displayed an anti Canadian side swipe.

I loathe humour which is used to hide or mask hostile feelings and reactions.

Comedy should be a vehicle to make you laugh and lighten your heart, it should never be used to laugh "at a group". Among close friends we can use humour to "laugh at ourselves" and that is very different.

Please drop the term "anything goes" and better still for the integrity of this excellent site, please remove this scar on our face.

A hyperlink to a joke website can be made and more importantly the chatroom can be a great place for shared fun and laughter amongst ourselves and on theme.

I am asking that the Jokes Section be removed. Do you agree?

I normally skip over a lot of stuff in the jokes section granted, because some of them don't seem funny to me.

Your post seems disturbing though, so Im going to reply and hopefully it wont break out into a fire on politics.

My friends and I are always making fun of jews. Not sure why they come up so often, but they do. Now, I personally dont know any jews, but if one were around to listen to our comments on these people, I would hope that they would have a good set of jokes regarding the white man or s/he would teach us that our views on jews are wrong and set us straight. I try to teach tolerance in everything I do. If I dont like something, as long as it doesnt DIRECTLY involve me, I give my own comments, maybe, on the subject or I stay out. When I say DIRECTLY, I mean direct as in, the Canandian Sac_mec, not a canadian in general.

Apparently people like the Joke's section, otherwise it wouldnt be used. I notice a lot of times the views on a partcuilar thread in jokes are sometimes high. so it must be worthwhile.

I don't think anything should be changed. Learn tolerance of other people and if you can't learn that, teach people how there views need changing. Personally, I practice both tolerance and trying to teach understanding.

Odd how this http://www.eunuch.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=4635 got posted and no women started the same comments you have.

I actually like the humor boards and the deep dark cellar. I think humor is a good release for the tensions of the day.

I voted to keep them...

I definately think there is a place for boards like the J,L&L section. It provides an outlet for people and keeps off topic discussion (semi) contained in an area where at least you KNOW it's likely to be irreverant.

No, don't scrap it.

There will always be someone who can find offence in the most innocent of remarks and who will take a 'put down' very seriously. All I can say is that they must be very sad people.

Politicians, have no one but themselves to blame if they become the butt of someones humour. I believe, that originally, the person mentioned was Billy Graham or, if not him some other fundamentalist evangelist.

If people find the section offensive, then they do not have to read it.

LOL

I vote to keep the section. I enjoy reading a good joke. I do hope that people don't take them as a personal attack towards any ethnic or racial slander. I, for one, would miss then should they be removed.

No. This is a good thing.

By my count, my vote makes it 8-1 to retain the board

But every now and then I get this URGE to write a godawful shaggy dog story capped by an atrocious pun. Where else could I publish it besides here and in alt.callahans?

Andrew (imported) wrote: Thu Jan 15, 2004 3:37 pm But every now and then I get this URGE to write a godawful shaggy dog story capped by an atrocious pun. Where else could I publish it besides here and in alt.callahans?

And Andrew, I must say, I would miss them terribly. There's nothing I like better than a pun that's simultaneously terrible and clever.

I vote to keep it.I need all the laughs I can find. Flo

We must keep the joke thread open, however I would ask anybody posting a joke to keep in mine that it doesn't offend someone. <O:p

<O:p</O:p

My reason for this is that very few if any of us has actually met others here at the Archive. We come from all over the world, we are all races, religions, sexual orientations, age groups, you name we are it. I don't like race jokes, maybe because in my immediately family 3 of the 5 races are represented. (Guess)

Keep the joke section, just think about what you are posting and ask yourself can it offend someone.

<O:p</O:p

River

Riverwind (imported) wrote: Mon Jan 19, 2004 1:34 am We must keep the joke thread open, however I would ask anybody posting a joke to keep in mine that it doesn't offend someone. <O:p

<O:p</O:p

River

Noted. I suppose this means I should not post a joke along the lines of.....

In Scotland, why do the Scots wear kilts?

To show their clan, family, or regional alliance.

In Scotland, why do visiting Americans wear kilts?

Because the sound of zippers make the sheep nervous.

.....so I won't.

I've been having mixed feelings all week and felt a sense of some surprise that so many people viewed this thread and that so few have voted.

The vote results, to date, appear to support the continuation of the Joke

Section. I wish to thank Riverwind for making the one single comment of support. As I pointed out in response on the Joke board, by asking this question it appears I set myself up as a "big bad censor". However, every minute of every day we have or choose to make decisions which include one course and exclude another, so we are all practising individual censorship all the time. Two of the issues that encouraged me to start this debate were :

a) The comment - "Anything goes" written above the Joke board and

b) A search under "New Posts" leads a reader directly to the Joke board.

This board is not at all central to the Archive and personally I believe it's net effect is negative, if you want schoolyard humour why come here??

There are bigger fish to fry and perhaps I should have kept my mouth shut,

but I did start a debate which has prompted tatula elsewhere to say that the

Archive is "not politically correct". Many of you will take that as a compliment, a good thing but I do note that some of the jokes have absolutely no connection with the lifestyles of eunuchs. Does that matter?

Well, to me, it does.Isn't that the focus of this site? There are degrees of choice and selection/censorship in all our lives it is a fact. I pointed out right at the start that I have a great sense of humour and love to laugh - including laughing at myself - good, positive humour is an enhancement to life; comedy is used frequently though as a vehicle to maintain status quo attitudes or as a way to make those reading feel "more superior" than those at the butt of the joke. Those kind of jokes are hostile to the views we seek society to question and THAT kind of humour just isn't plain funny. The EA, made the decision to drop the pics of males and females - they can be found elsewhere. Please think about this issue and judge if you wish the site to facilitate the Joke Board. So far, I see your feelings loud and clear from the few who have voted. I hope this thread and our individual thoughts about it continue.

Dear Sac-Mec,

I'm sorry that so many people disagree with your view to remove the joke section (including myself). I find the message board a very well structured place and there is a section for just about every aspect of eunuchism, even a transgendered section now. I think the EA needs a place like the cellar and joke section. It's where we, as friends, share things among us that do not pertain directly to the Eunuch Archive. Yes, sometimes someone is going to hit a nerve that doesn't agree with everyone, and I've see some of the heated debates that have gone on in those threads. But that's what the moderators of this board are there for. They can step in and stop a thread if it goes too far. I too have felt like I've been offended by some of the jokes posted in that section, but I chose to read them. I do not get upset about it. I guess I can tolerate them although I do not like some of them. Just like the story section of the message board, I choose not to read them. Ok, I'm probably missing out on a lot of good stories, but I'm not hear for the fantasy aspect, I'm hear to learn and teach others about the reality of castration. You, my friend, also have that choice not to read them.

I'm glad you made a decision to voice your opinion on this matter. But like you say, there are so many that have viewed this thread and so little response to it, I wish we could have their opinions also. It seems like only a handful of active members really do post to the threads here.

Although I personally don't browse the joke section much, I do think its needed. It helps balance thinks out here. We all need a good laugh once in a while to cheer us up.

Sac-mec,

As a real life Eunuch, I felt obligated to post my opinion on this post's subject matter. Here are my thoughts, posted in RED below.

Robby

Sac_mec (imported) wrote: Mon Jan 19, 2004 3:17 am I've been having mixed feelings all week and felt a sense of some surprise that so many people viewed this thread and that so few have voted.

Now you know the reality of this site. Not all readers will post or participate in Polls...

Sac_mec (imported) wrote: Mon Jan 19, 2004 3:17 am The vote results, to date, appear to support the continuation of the Joke

Section. I wish to thank Riverwind for making the one single comment of support. As I pointed out in response on the Joke board, by asking this question it appears I set myself up as a "big bad censor". However, every minute of every day we have or choose to make decisions which include one course and exclude another, so we are all practising individual censorship all the time. T

his issue goes to adulthood...we are faced with decision making processes each and every day of our lives. If life experiences contained no decision making processes, where would we be today? No one could answer that question as fate, or whatever you want to call it, would have taken charge and I am not sure fate would have created the E. A. ... Bboy created the Archive with his decision, and each and every member's decision to contribute to the success of this site is what we see today.

Sac_mec (imported) wrote: Mon Jan 19, 2004 3:17 am Two of the issues that encouraged me to start this debate were :

a) The comment - "Anything goes" written above the Joke board and

b) A search under "New Posts" leads a reader directly to the Joke board.

This board is not at all central to the Archive and personally I believe it's net effect is negative, if you want schoolyard humour why come here??

Jokes are part of a Eunuch's life. School yard humor is part of a Eunuch's life. Reading this thread is part of a Eunuch's life... What I am saying here is this: Eunuchs are people. They have brains. They make decisions. They feel pain, pleasure, want and desire. They have loved ones who care for them. They have children, parents, aunts and uncles. They wear clothes and earn a living like most other folks. They own businesses, they rely on the medical system in place for their health needs. They are resilient, fragile, strong, weak minded, users, abusers, good people, wealthy, wise, poor, milded mannered, rude, nice, kind and gentle. You see, they are like all other people on this planet because they are a member of the human race. No different, no better, no worse. Eunuchs just have no testicles like the thousands of women who have no ovaries.

Sac_mec (imported) wrote: Mon Jan 19, 2004 3:17 am There are bigger fish to fry and perhaps I should have kept my mouth shut,

but I did start a debate which has prompted tatula elsewhere to say that the

Archive is "not politically correct". Many of you will take that as a compliment, a good thing but I do note that some of the jokes have absolutely no connection with the lifestyles of eunuchs. Does that matter? Well, to me, it does.

What is the lifestyle of a Eunuch? Is it any different than the lifestyle we lived with prior to getting our testicles cut off? Is it something exclusive? Is it not normal, whatever that means?... Is it new and improved? You get my drift? Eunuch lifestyle does not exist. We as a human being have a lifestyle if you must call it by name but we are not a select group of people because we have no testicles. We pee and shit like other men and eat like others too. We just cannot make babies... like women who have no ovaries. Do we see women without ovaries any differently than when they did have them in place? Of course not...

Sac_mec (imported) wrote: Mon Jan 19, 2004 3:17 am Isn't that the focus of this site?

Again, of course not...

Sac_mec (imported) wrote: Mon Jan 19, 2004 3:17 am There are degrees of choice and selection/censorship in all our lives it is a fact. I pointed out right at the start that I have a great sense of humour and love to laugh - including laughing at myself - good, positive humour is an enhancement to life; comedy is used frequently though as a vehicle to maintain status quo attitudes or as a way to make those reading feel "more superior" than those at the butt of the joke. Those kind of jokes are hostile to the views we seek society to question and THAT kind of humour just isn't plain funny.

As stated previously, the mature action to take is bypassing the Jokes section if you are offended. Choice. Your choice.

Sac_mec (imported) wrote: Mon Jan 19, 2004 3:17 am The EA, made the decision to drop the pics of males and females - they can be found elsewhere. Please think about this issue and judge if you wish the site to facilitate the Joke Board. So far, I see your feelings loud and clear from the few who have voted. I hope this thread and our individual thoughts about it continue.

This section (Jokes) will live for the foreseeable future as the vote results seems to be telling you something. The voters like the section. Members who do not vote may be okay with the Jokes section but we do not know until they vote. To look at the bright side of this issue, keeping it until the 'powers to be' want it gone seems to be the popular consensus.

Robby, many many thanks for your thoughts. I do take issue with maybe one central point with you and that is about "Eunuch Lifestyle". It does exist,

as Andrew would say "to a different degree etc and at a different rate" but it exists. As a tiny example of the difference between the life of a Chemical or Surgical Eunuch have a read of A-1's joke on the "Geography of Women".

It includes at the end a perspective of the "Geography of Men" but it actually only notes and records the "goegraphy" of virile men who are potent and sexually focused. There are many different types of Eunuch and some achieve Eunuch calm, it's something via Androcur which I have found.

My "geography" and "perspectives" have changed radically to softer, gentler attitudes and to an awareness of Gender issues and insight. I am a very different man and yet the same person. I do believe restricting Testosterone for a long period - for me 19 months- has "enabled" me and made me think alot too. Incidentally, in choosing one single joke from one contributor I am not pointing any finger, I'm just pointing out at the absence of a Eunuch

perspective within the joke and I think that very definately there are a number of "Eunuch lifestyles". I look forward to Jesus' perspectives on this when he writes about the site and "all of us".

I don't want to "go on ad nauseum" about Eunuch Lifestyles here because there is more than enough material there for a long and interesting seperate posting in Eunuch Central. I'll just signal now that we can express our

attitudes and feelings on the subject in a number of ways. Did we make the decision or was it imposed by illness or the wishes of our partners?

Did we choose the chemical route or surgical or faith based or scene based?

How has the outcome played out since? Have we wanted to remain free of HRT and been obliged to take it? Have we managed to greatly reduce our testosterone? How do we feel about that?

Please don't answer these points here, Robby, they are "indicators" that I hope can be picked up on for a new major thread. Can someone pick up the ball and run with that thread please?

Robby, many thanks for your reply. Starting this posting has had a purpose.

I shan't be close to a PC for some days so don't look upon my apparent silence as being meaningful. I just won't be able to "log in" for some days.

I'm off on very gentle and will also be very happy when I am at home and I can rest up and be comfortable. So for a few days from me, it is

sacmech,

It is my opinion that lots of men, the ones whom laugh at this site because it scares the hell out of them, use testosterone as an excuse for their own bad behavior.

I have no doubt that it does influence behavior, and certainly behavior changes when it is gone. On the other hand, many men can control themselves if they would just try. If men would look at everyone as a member of humanity and an equal things in the world would be so much different.

But typically, they practice a form of one-upsmanship and keep a sense of superiority that they have to constantly demonstrate through an endless variety of games, contests, and violent displays of inhumanity and they have influenced women to do the same to a certain degree.

It really sucks and it is the reason why there is so much strife, violence and even war. I tire of hearing of all the standard excuses, from men and women, trying to justify their own bad behavior so that they can carry on their own little selfish lives with their illusions of superiority in a hopless display of ignorant denial.

Don't let people tell you for a moment that they have to behave poorly because they are 'hormonally challenged'. They can do better, if they would try. They are perpetuating a myth. After they have been castrated or nullified or whatever they no longer have a choice regarding their behavior. Beforehand they do, and they will look anywhere for absolution.

We will miss you. Be careful, hurry home and GOD SPEED...

Sincerely,

A-1

In my view, you are more or less correct, A-1--but the behaviors you describe, are essentially ones which are developed, because society encourages them. That is to say, before people are changed much--and that may be true for the castrated as well as for the uncastrated--the society in which they live, will have to be changed in a fundamental way. Yes, people do have free will, and could resist the pressures on them. But in reality, very few individuals will stand alone against a multitude that is determined to force them to do its will.

What makes a good joke?

Does a joke need to use a lot of foul language to be funny?

<O:p</O:p

Does a joke need to make fun of some ones nationally?

<O:p</O:p

Does a joke need to make fun of some ones race?

<O:p</O:p

Does a joke need to make fun of some ones religion?

<O:p</O:p

Does a joke need to be political to be funny?

<O:p</O:p

The answer to all of the above is of course NO.

<O:p</O:p

So what makes a joke funny?

<O:p</O:p

A good story with an unexpected punch line is what makes a joke funny

Guido and his grandson were up on top of a hill over looking his town.

He said to his grandson,

<O:p</O:p

See the bridge that crosses the river over there. I designed that bridge but do they call me Guido the engineer?

No.

<O:p</O:p

See the beautiful university campus the grounds and all, I did that. But do they call me Guido the landscaper?

No.

<O:p</O:p

See that track of houses over there, I built them, do they call me Guido the builder.

No

<O:p</O:p

See the Mall over there with the 500 stores; do they call me Guido the Businessman? No.

<O:p</O:p

See the fountain in the town square, I made that, but do they call me Guido the artist? NO.

<O:p</O:p

But you fuck one goat.

I voted against scrapping the Cellar and JL&L forums and I certainly still believe that ... however ---

I do hate to log on to the boards, do a new posts search and find that 8 out of 10 new posts are all on the jokes board -- well that does get very frustrating for me.

I think it's the responsibility of members not to abuse the boards, either.

Bboy,

I am responsible for those statistics.

Jokes that I posted have been floating around for years, most of them, usually modified for one reason or another.

It is never the quantity of the posts but instead the QUALITY of the posts that matters here. It has always been that way and that is the way that it will always be.

Recently Jesus and I had a private message correspondence and we have much in common, in addition to this archive. I have contributed to the story board in the past and Jesus if facisnated from a investivigative/research standpoint. I am not sure why I am here and why I like this place so much, except that each soul who frequents this place has their own story and are in need of input from others regarding their questions of the day.

The joke board can really cheer one up and make one forget about the cares of the day at times. My only purpose in putting jokes there is to try to provide a place where everyone can go and get a laugh or two without leaving the site. I feel that board to be a kind of a pressure relief valve that is always there if you need a diversion from a sensitive subject for a short time.

On a joke board, usually everything is fair game and it more reflects the world in which we live than it offers a comment on any individual or group of individuals.

Again, it is not the jokes that are important here. It is instead the exchange of ideas and the fellowship that everyone here seeks, eunuch or no, str8 or gay, transexual, ambiguously, or conventially sexed or oversexed looking for relief (I plead guilty!) or just plain boring. This board displays as much diversity as you could expect under the title of Eunuch and we all look out for each other to the best of our abilities.

SO, if I have offended anybody with who I am, I am truly sorry. I doubt that I will change unless provided with good reason and I, again am truly sorry if I have offended anybody because I did not intend to do that. Instead, I think that all of you are GREAT, yes, each and every one, GREAT.

A-1

You certainly haven't OFFENDED me in any way ... the jokes are fine. My real point is/was that I wish there was a bit more spirited discussion on the boards OUTSIDE the Celler/JL&L sections - not that the JL&L sections have to slow down.

Bboy wrote: Tue Jan 27, 2004 11:07 pm I do hate to log on to the boards, do a new posts search and find that 8 out of 10 new posts are all on the jokes board -- well that does get very frustrating for me.

Well, I guess I am one of the culprits. In the last few days I have posted three jokes...or rather, two shaggy dog stories ending in atrocious puns, and a bit of real humor for the dog lovers in the EA. I am sure there must be a few.