Bone loss in eunuchs

For castration-related posts that just don’t seem to fit anywhere else.
happousai (imported)
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Re: Bone loss in eunuchs

Post by happousai (imported) »

Andrew (imported) wrote: Fri May 17, 2002 9:02 pm Came across this informative article on a possible future tretment for osteoporosis that should be of interest to all of us

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sc...000/1989461.stm

Can you post that URL again? It got corrupted. It really has the "..." in it.
luvpain (imported)
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Re: Bone loss in eunuchs

Post by luvpain (imported) »

Happousai,

Did a search of the site, and found the link.

Cosmonaut shacken back to health (http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sci/te ... 989461.stm)
Bboy
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Re: Bone loss in eunuchs

Post by Bboy »

As someone who regularly has to take prednisone and/or kenalog (steroids) for asthma, I am a HIGH risk for osteoporosis myself. Am interested in the most effective preventative measures -- ie: what calcium suppliments work best, are best absorbed, etc.

I will say that per my doctor's instructions I know that vitamin D is essential in the uptake of calcium, so any calcium suppliment you take ought to be combined with D in at least a 600 cal/200 D ratio.
Andrew (imported)
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Re: Bone loss in eunuchs

Post by Andrew (imported) »

Bboy wrote: Mon May 20, 2002 7:05 am I will say that per my doctor's instructions I know that vitamin D is essential in the uptake of calcium, so any calcium suppliment you take ought to be combined with D in at least a 600 cal/200 D ratio.

My program has three parts:

1) 4 tablets daily of Willner Chemists Bone Complex, for 800 mg of calcium and 200 IU of vitamin D-3. I take two on waking up and two at lunch.

2) A multivitamin/multimineral tablet, taken at supper, that provides another 400 IU of Vitamin D.

3) 3 calcium citrate tablets at bedtime to bring me up to a daily intake of 1,500 mg of calcium.

Plus lots of walking around at work on a rock hard floor.

My physician, Donna Garnier P.A., has approved this program, and told me I was unlikely to get osteoporsis. Still, I will get a DEXA bone density scan every two years just to be sure.

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antonia (imported)
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Re: Bone loss in eunuchs

Post by antonia (imported) »

Long-term follow-up of bone mineral density and bone metabolism in transsexuals treated with cross-sex hormones

Paul van Kesteren, Paul Lips, Louis J. G. Gooren,

Henk Asscheman and Jos Megens

Department of Endocrinology, Academic Hospital Vrje

Universiteit, Amsterdam, The Netherlands

(Received 5 June 1997; returned for revision 25 July 1997;

finally revised 5 September 1997; accepted 14 October 1997)

Summary

OBJECTIVE lt is unknown whether long term cross sex hormone treatment affects the human skeleton. We monitored bone mineral density and biochemical markers of bone turnover for 28β€”63 months in 20 male-to-female transsexuals (M-F) treated with anti-androgens and oestrogens, and 19 female-to-male transsexuals (F-M) treated with androgens. They underwent gonadectomy 13β€”35 months after the start of cross-sex hormone administration.

DESIGN Bone mineral density (BMD) and the markers of bone turnover osteocalcin, alkaline phosphatase, fasting urinary calcium/creatinine and hydroxyproline/creatinine, were measured at baseline, after 1 year and after 28β€”63 months of cross-sex hormone administration.

RESULTS In oestrogen-treated Mβ€”F, variables of bone turnover decreased significantly with consecutive measurements. BMD had increased significantly after 1 year, but decreased again to baseline levels after 28β€”63 months of cross-sex hormones.

In Fβ€”M, alkaline phosphatase levels increased during the first year. BMD did not change during the first year but had decreased significantly after 28β€”63 months following ovariectomy. In both M β€” F and Fβ€”M, the change of BMD correlated inversely with serum LH and FSH levels. Of all biochemical variables LH levels appeared to be the best predictor of loss of BMD; in the long-term LH levels were more elevated in testosterone-treated Fβ€” M than in oestrogen-treated M β€”. F transsexuals.

CONCLUSION In M-F, oestrogen treatment prevented bone loss after testosterone deprivation. In F β€” M the testosterone dosage used, associated with a decline in serum oestradiol levels, was unable to maintain bone mass fully in all subjects in the Longer term. The inverse relationship between BMD and serum LH levels suggests that the dose of hormone replacement has been too 10w in subjects with a decline in their BMD. Its cause might be under dosing or non-compliance in some patients. We propose that serum LH levels may be used as a measure of the adequacy of replacement with sex steroids.

I did read another survey on the subject specifically for post menopause women.

There they claimed that HRT(hormone replacement therapy) did stop or significantly reduce osteoporosis.

Noticed and very interesting was the fact that every time HRT was ceased that the patients showed a significant loss of bone density.

This result of bone density loss would occur every time the patient stopped taking HRT.

Multiplies the risk of osteoporosis and bone density loss!

The suggestion therefor was that patients with high risk or signs of osteoporosis should take HRT in small doses for the rest of their lives.

If the patient is less dangered of being osteoporous then it would be better looking for other methods of treatment(calcium supplementation).

I think what IEunich is experiencing is just what I have described.

His HRT is not regular and he seems to stop for several months and then continues.

This would result in a high % of bone mineral loss every time he does this.

When he recontinues HRT his bone mineral density does not increase...because HRT does not support bone mineral increase...just prevents the loss!!!

your antonia πŸ‘„ 🌹 :withstupi
SplitDick (imported)
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Re: Bone loss in eunuchs

Post by SplitDick (imported) »



>
Andrew (imported) wrote: Thu May 16, 2002 2:06 pm OK, I am not quite sure what you mean about the difference

> between a "childhood pre-sexual state" and a "senior post-



> sexual state". Care to explain?

There are three major hormonal modes during a human life:

1) Pre-pubescent which ends at puberty.

2) Sexually viable which ends at menopause/andropause.

3) Post-menopause/andropause.

Life in modes 1 and 3 are much different, even though both are asexual states.

A pre-pubescent is lively, active, giggly. A post-andropausal is sedate, must make an effort to stay active, and occasionally gets a hearty chuckle.

No offence to you Andrew, you seem to have a very pleasant life, but it seems to be a sedate one. My goal for castration would ideally be to return to be lively, active, giggly, but without the burden of sexuality. I would rather be playing on monkey bars than tending a rose garden. For me that is mode 1 rather than mode 3. Now I will certainly appreciate mode 3 when it is my time, but I don't want to be living a "senior" lifestyle before I'm 30!

I realize that returning to mode 1 impossible -- that is why I commented "too bad ...". I just don't want to rush into mode 3.
Andrew (imported)
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Re: Bone loss in eunuchs

Post by Andrew (imported) »

[
SplitDick (imported) wrote: Wed May 22, 2002 1:46 am No offence to you Andrew, you seem to have a very pleasant life, but it seems to be a sedate one.

No offense taken. An excellent post, in fact. But I am going to reply to this post in a brand new thread that I will start, since this has drifted away from the topic of osteoporosis.πŸ“– πŸ“– πŸ“– πŸ“– πŸ“–
Andrew (imported)
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Re: Bone loss in eunuchs

Post by Andrew (imported) »

Also a request to others who have osteoporosis, may be on the way to getting osteoporosis, or feel a need to start learning about it now. I have joined the internet newsgroup...

sci.med.disease.osteoporosis

...and perhaps you should also.

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A-1 (imported)
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Re: Bone loss in eunuchs

Post by A-1 (imported) »

Somebody on another thread was talking to a Vet.

I was just wondering if anyone knows why neutered pets like dogs and cats do not seem to suffer from osteoporosis like people do.

Sometimes I wonder if diet has a lot to do with it.

πŸ™‡ A-1 πŸ™‡
Andrew (imported)
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Re: Bone loss in eunuchs

Post by Andrew (imported) »

SplitDick (imported) wrote: Tue May 14, 2002 6:58 am Andrew,

I stand by my message about eunuch-wannabes poorly assessing risks (such as oesteoporosis). Actually, all humans are poor at risk-assessment and make decisions based on short-term gain or based on the fact they don't believe it can happen to them (like JeffEunuch saying "it's just a risk").

Well, I am typing this on Wednesday 29 May. On 23 May I posted an article titled "May is National Osteoporosis Month" that had links to several websites on the topic. The total lack of interest in reality can be seen by the fact that after seven days, it has had only 40 views and no replys. So it seems you are right and I am wrong. Now...why?

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Riverwind (imported)
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Re: Bone loss in eunuchs

Post by Riverwind (imported) »

Being Chemically Castrated and surgery set for September I still don't think enough study has been made with males in mind or eunuch. However I am already on a regiment of taking 1500 mg of calcium per day. On another board a post by Paolo on castrati I found this link its worth taking a look.

http://www.mercksharpdohme.com/disease/ ... d0061.html

One of the things that popped out at me was smoking and drinking is a big contributor to osteoporosis. Like anything in life, if you eat right, exercise, watch what you put into your body for the most part it will treat you right. ;) πŸ‡ΊπŸ‡Έ ;)
Andrew (imported)
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Re: Bone loss in eunuchs

Post by Andrew (imported) »

Riverwind (imported) wrote: Sun Jun 09, 2002 5:41 am One of the things that popped out at me was smoking and drinking is a big contributor to osteoporosis. Like anything in life, if you eat right, exercise, watch what you put into your body for the most part it will treat you right. ;) πŸ‡ΊπŸ‡Έ ;)

I have never smoked in my life, and have been sober since 24 February 1984. My Physician informed me that another risk factor for osteoporosis was caffeine, so I now avoid it. Soft Drinks have too much phosphorus and I avoid those also.

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