Non-Pejorative

[JesusA]

The cover article for the latest issue of TIME magazine is titled "Beyond He or She." The opening line reads, "A growing number of young people are moving beyond the idea that we live in a world where sexuality and gender come in only two forms." TIME reports that up to 20% of the young millennial generation identify themselves as something other than strictly straight or as conforming to the sex that they were assigned at birth.

What do we say to a young person, assigned male at birth (in other words, having the standard male external plumbing features), but who has convinced both parents and psychiatrists that he is NOT male, but not female either? I consult with two psychiatrists about young people like this: Both were put on puberty blockers at age 12. Currently, one is 13 and desires an orchiectomy without hormone replacement before age 16 (when a local surgeon will perform it). What term can be used by the general public in speaking to and about these young persons as they grow older?

Their psychiatrists resist the term "eunuch" because of the pejorative connotations of the word. While everyone on this site knows better, the stereotype of "eunuch" held by the general public is of a fat, lazy Black slave in the harem of some Oriental potentate.

The word "asexual" has now been pre-empted to describe a sexual orientation (like gay or straight). It is not used for sexual identity. "Genderqueer" has been pre-empted to mean somewhere on the male-to-female scale, but not at the ends.

Rather than giving a list of possibilities here and asking for comments, what term other than "eunuch" could you use for a male castrated before puberty? What might such a teenager or young adult who has had testicles removed and does not intend to transition to female call his gender? What word might a young person born a female who has had a hysterectomy and breast reduction surgery before taking just enough testosterone to take on an androgynous presentation be called? (The Time article gives an example of one such person.)

What might be a better term for modern young people to use?

[sparkey49 (imported)]

This is interesting to think about as I had a desire of castration starting before puberty but never desired to be a female. I have wondered but of course will never know how that would of been. I have done some resurch and found a study where 3 guys in their early twenties who had never gone through puberty due to medical reasons like their testicles never developing etc. Atleast one was married and they all lived normal healthy lives with none of the side effects of castration after puberty. They were given T for a period of time and all went through effects of puberty and then the T was removed and all of them went through the effects of castrarion requiring use of T for life to maintain health. So my thoughts is that for those whom are young and desire to be asexual (or whatever name used) the puberty blockers and castration is probably the way to go to maybe prevent the necessity of hormone treatment. I wish I didn't have to be on hormone replacement but ended up on it due to medical reasons after 2.5 years of no T. I have been trying to find the medical article I had read while resurching Testosterone at the time of starting TRT.

[paring (imported)]

With all the chimical contamination, from agriculture and the food industries, that are andocrine disruptors, I'm not surprised that 20% of the youth having gender issues. I just wonder if this is part of Illuminati's agenda to eliminate 6,5 billion people on earth. To answer your question, I'd say the best term to describe those who have gender issues would be "trans" up until they choose the gender they prefer.

[paring (imported)]

What better way to reduce the population than voluntary castration and or gender transformation. Nobody that changes gender is going to reproduce and castration is obvious. If a man wants to be castrated and isn't forced, what's the big harm?

I agree with you,I don't see any problem with that either, as long as it is consensual. "His body, his right" The Bill Gates foundation has tried to eliminate a few millions by giving free tetanus vaccines, to Africans countries, containing a substance to render the recipient sterile. That wasn't consensual at all. Also, Asian countries consume more soy milk and they also have the highest transgender rate in the world. I wonder again who's behind this.

[Losethem (imported)]

I'll give a short and direct answer. What do you call those people? You call them what THEY wish to be called.

[Dave (imported)]

I'll give a short and direct answer. What do you call those people? You call them what THEY wish to be called.

How would you refer to them as a group -- think of a word like "transgender" which doesn't fit eunuchs and its polar opposite is "cisgender"

[hopper44 (imported)]

How would you refer to them as a group -- think of a word like "transgender" which doesn't fit eunuchs and its polar opposite is "cisgender"

I've seen eunuch grouped under the transgender umbrella, so it could be used for a group with varying intentions. Neutrois might be applicable if we are talking about a group who are not looking to transition further. For individuals I agree that they should be called whatever they wish to be called.

I did read the Time article and came away with a renewed sense of hope for the future. The younger generation is getting away from the rigid gender and sexual identities that have always irked me.

[Losethem (imported)]

How would you refer to them as a group -- think of a word like "transgender" which doesn't fit eunuchs and its polar opposite is "cisgender"

That's the problem, you're not going to get a complete answer that will fit everyone. I prefer nullo when speaking about my modification specifically, but everything I else I'm a man. Male pronouns, etc. For me, Male-to-Eunuch (MtE) is a broad enough umbrella to capture all as far as obtaining legitimate help for the surgical body changes, but when speaking specifically to the individual it should be what they want to be called.

I shared this in the (link) therapist letter I shared that cleared me for my penectomy surgery (http://forums.eunuch.org/showthread.php ... post255464) two years ago.

In my case I'm a man first, nullo second. Most others I know that have taken this path also prefer "nullo."

[Hopeful1 (imported)]

A lot of my friends who consider themselves neither male or female use Enbee (NB) or non-binary. There is one mainstream church here where the pastor was AFAB (aissigned female at birth), has had top surgery (mastectomy) but does not identify as male. Another friend, AMAB (male at birth) has had hormone therapy, top surgery (breast implants) but wears shirts, ties and coats to work. They also identify as non-binary although they frequently use the Native American term "two spirit." I think though the term non-binary fits most people but like LT said, "whatever they want to be called."

[sparkey49 (imported)]

I agree with LT I am a male and present as male who happens to be a eunuch by choice!

[Prismatic (imported)]

Anyone not identifying as male or female would be considered non-binary regardless of surgical or chemical alterations made, so why not that?

I'm pretty different from other non-binary identifying people myself but I don't think there needs to be special terms talking about each type of non-binary person, especially something as rare these days as someone castrated prior to puberty. If one existed and did not identify as male or female they could describe themselves/be described neutrally as "non-binary castrated AMAB"

[ZeuterMe (imported)]

My first impression: Gelding. Of the words I know for an altered animal, it's the only one with positive connotation, and it's relatively widely understood.

I'm going to go back and read the rest of the thread, but I value my gut reactions, so I figure I'll share that before I second-guess it!

[OneBallBoi (imported)]

One thing that I learned in the last 6 months. October 1st I got on Medicare and Medicare Supplemental.. Part of my Supplemental program is a free membership in the YMCA. I have learned one thing from being in the locker rooms. They are all the same size, Small. Modesty is out the window. You have seen on penis, you have seen them all and they are all small. You quickly loose any scare.. They are all the same size, Small.

[erikboy (imported)]

Human.

No need to stress non existing gender.

[Losethem (imported)]

My first impression: Gelding. Of the words I know for an altered animal, it's the only one with positive connotation, and it's relatively widely understood.

I'm going to go back and read the rest of the thread, but I value my gut reactions, so I figure I'll share that before I second-guess it!

I'd personally find being branded a gelding offensive. Perhaps fine for others, but I think it's actually a pejorative if used to try to cover all.

[Prismatic (imported)]

I'd personally find being branded a gelding offensive. Perhaps fine for others, but I think it's actually a pejorative if used to try to cover all.

I agree with LT on this one, although for me it seems pejorative mainly based off of how it is typically associated with animals.

[ka.dick. (imported)]

How about "a person"?

I dunno why we need to use labels, much less create them artificially. A term will probably pop up at one point, or perhaps some generic term will find a new use for this purpose (just like the world 'gay' had a different meaning originally).

As a side note, it's really just a language thing. I find it interesting how various languages deal with genders differently. In some, every noun including non-living objects has to have a gender. In others, most designations of people have to have genders. In some, it's not necessary. E.g. in English, you say 'customer' and it's gender-neutral unless you specify it. But some, perhaps most, languages have a permanent declension system to assign a gender to the word.

I find it annoying; at the very least, these arbitrary rules make it difficult to learn new languages. But again languages evolve and this will sort out on its own. For now, I would rather avoid assigning some artificial designation "just because".