Can a Eunuch Hold and Love?

[dee2essohkay (imported)]

Hi, Here I am recently castrated. Castration was a recent goal and it was a lifelong goal too. But I never wanted to be alone. I just was never able to find the trick to make holding and loving a happy and real thing in my life. So now, I'm wondering (by no means regretting my new status) if I might now be able to Hold and Love? Have I made Holding and Loving an unnecessary thing? Are they still necessary things and do I still have something to offer? Do I still have something to be received? Am i now finally able to receive? Will I be able to give something of a person (me) who still wants to be connected?

[magusuk89 (imported)]

We are a hypersocial species. Studies have shown touch is a fundamental need to all members of our species, and that we perish quickly without it -- so do not neglect the needs you have, to the extent you feel them. Listen to your emotions and your body. Love is something located in the soul (as a Neoplatonist what I mean by this could be rougly equated to our sense of identity) and the mind, so is not impaired in any way by castration. As for esssential dignity, intrinsic value, and physical desirability, detesticulated folks are more frequently fetishised than rejected... which is perhaps not a comfort, but goes to illustrate that there is no barrier to the possibility of being deeply physically appreciated by other people.

So there is every reason to go out into the world with a good spirit.

Congratulations on your successful operation -- I only hope I can follow you soon!

[Valery_V (imported)]

We are a hypersocial species. Studies have shown touch is a fundamental need to all members of our species, and that we perish quickly without it -- so do not neglect the needs you have, to the extent you feel them. Listen to your emotions and your body. Love is something located in the soul (as a Neoplatonist what I mean by this could be rougly equated to our sense of identity) and the mind, so is not impaired in any way by castration. As for esssential dignity, intrinsic value, and physical desirability, detesticulated folks are more frequently fetishised than rejected... which is perhaps not a comfort, but goes to illustrate that there is no barrier to the possibility of being deeply physically appreciated by other people.

So there is every reason to go out into the world with a good spirit.

Congratulations on your successful operation -- I only hope I can follow you soon!

I fully support. Excellently said!

I join in the congratulations.

[WheelyCurious]

Love of the have and hold sort is something that happens when you are NOT intent on having a sexual experience (Though sex can be a part of it)... Getting rid of particular bits of sexual equipment may change what one is able to do in bed (or similar places...) but doesn't change what you may be able to feel for another person...

Heinlein defined love as the condition where the happiness and wellbeing of another is essential to ones own happiness.... Nothing in there about boinking!

Due to our mutual disabilities and limitations, my GF and I have had little that most folks would consider sex beyond the minimal foreplay level, but we still love each other...

Romance is in the brain, not the balls....

WheelyCurious

[Arab Nights (imported)]

Love, fondness, whatever you call it, is all over the place. Anyone who looks at the animal clips so common now sees it is not limited to one species and can bond between species. Many horse owners know that. Any dog owner who treats their dog as family knows that. Any dog owner who keeps the dog outside on a chain or in a kennel does not know that. The raven that befriended me while I was building a fence around my front yard knew that. It is not that every individual can love every other individual. It is way beyond my simple human capabalities to understand how it works, but somehow bonds just develop. Unless you have built the wall and blocked yourself off.

[dee2essohkay (imported)]

Love, fondness, whatever you call it, is all over the place. Anyone who looks at the animal clips so common now sees it is not limited to one species and can bond between species. Many horse owners know that. Any dog owner who treats their dog as family knows that. Any dog owner who keeps the dog outside on a chain or in a kennel does not know that. The raven that befriended me while I was building a fence around my front yard knew that. It is not that every individual can love every other individual. It is way beyond my simple human capabalities to understand how it works, but somehow bonds just develop. Unless you have built the wall and blocked yourself off.

yeah! i think i know too. recently a robin stuck with me a while when i was going for a walk in a park. always stopping and watching me and then we'd move along. i'd do the same. there definitely was a connection

i want to add that the reason i originally asked the question is because i let my siblings know about my plan before i did it and they expressed reservations like "i think you shouldn't do it". but i did and further conversation with them never happened. i think they don't want to talk about it, but maybe they have the notion that the ability to love would end. idk, but maybe.

[Arab Nights (imported)]

Just to be clear, my comments included humans as well as people-animal. There are people you just hit it off with as long as you are open. My accupuncturist (Eastern medicine) commented that people are like plants. There are different plants that when you put them together both die and others when you put them together both thrive.

[BillyBlogs (imported)]

Hi, Here I am recently castrated. Castration was a recent goal and it was a lifelong goal too. But I never wanted to be alone. I just was never able to find the trick to make holding and loving a happy and real thing in my life. So now, I'm wondering (by no means regretting my new status) if I might now be able to Hold and Love? Have I made Holding and Loving an unnecessary thing? Are they still necessary things and do I still have something to offer? Do I still have something to be received? Am i now finally able to receive? Will I be able to give something of a person (me) who still wants to be connected?

Can you love someone after castration? Why not, I say. The way you frame your question tells me you have plenty to give. It just won't include any of those little tadpoles.

I think you will find that as you settle into your new you, how and why you relate to those you find attractive will make a lot more sense. The other thing is I think you were castrated to become complete. You sound a bit like you feel like you're a bit less of a person without the knackers, but that's not so. Quite the reverse, if you ask me.

Stand tall, no-balls. Now you're who you were mean't to be.

[dee2essohkay (imported)]

Can you love someone after castration? Why not, I say. The way you frame your question tells me you have plenty to give. It just won't include any of those little tadpoles.

I think you will find that as you settle into your new you, how and why you relate to those you find attractive will make a lot more sense. The other thing is I think you were castrated to become complete. You sound a bit like you feel like you're a bit less of a person without the knackers, but that's not so. Quite the reverse, if you ask me.

Stand tall, no-balls. Now you're who you were mean't to be.

Thanks. my biggest concern is not that I feel less, but that some important people in my life expressed reservations about my desire for the surgery prior to surgery, and then no longer made themselves available for further discussion. the possible insinuation that I might not be complete lingers as a thought combined with the awareness that I've always detached from love so I do wonder, now that I've been freed, will I finally have access to love?

[Umptieth (imported)]

Short answer: of course!

Love isn't just hormones (such as oxytocin).

It's something that you can freely give and receive, using your rationale rather than hormones. So yes, if you feel freed, you can concentrate on other things.

Choose to love and your love reservoir will never run dry. Choose to be loved, be open to love.

..

. the possible insinuation that I might not be complete ...

Really? To me, this is a big WTF.

And if you were missing an arm or a leg, would be you be less lovable?

So in time of need, people don't make themselves available. That's when you discover your real friends/loved ones.

All the best!

[BillyBlogs (imported)]

Hi there,

What I'm reading tells me that there's a good chance you're experiences parallel my own.

I too have been a 'loner' all my days. It's a very hard thing to put into words. There was always a sort of disconnect, a sense of wrongness, that seemed to infiltrate every relationship except those of a few very good friends. For myself, it was identifying as a gay man, which wasn't the case so I felt inauthentic.

I was trying to live up to what I thought were the expectations of the people around me, and it grew into a burden I couldn't carry any more.

If you can relate to this, then just let the nay-sayers go and be yourself. Trying to live up to the imagined expectations of those around us, based on fragments of opinions expressed is downright foolish. Or so I've recently found out.

Take Queen and Freddie's advice from 'Innuendo' -

"You can be anything you want to be

Just turn yourself into anything you think that you could ever be

Be free with your tempo, be free, be free

Surrender your ego, be free, be free to yourself"

You can hear the song here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j440-D5JhjI&t=1421s

starting at 23:41

The only shortcoming you have is there are no little sprogs in it.

Billy.

[dee2essohkay (imported)]

Take Queen and Freddie's advice from 'Innuendo' -

"You can be anything you want to be

Just turn yourself into anything you think that you could ever be

Be free with your tempo, be free, be free

Surrender your ego, be free, be free to yourself"

ok what you say does makes sense but i literally feel as if i'm blind or not looking (don't know which and it makes no difference) and i've hit a wall. i realize i need to take some kind of action in order to keep going, but i just don't. i don't think of what to do and make decisions. i'm filled with fear even though i realize that whatever there was to fear has become only a memory from the distant distant past. i am swayed by society's opinion of me - real or perceived - and or how they think i should conduct myself. all around i see people being judgmental and condemning. i've had ridiculous courage to self harm for most of my life, but to self help there is no courage at all.

there is one thing going on - and funny, i can't seem to stop it - it is a machine inside that i have no control over. the self harm turned to self help and it moves on impetus that i don't have knowledge of. it is just a thing inside me taking steps as much or as little as it can when it can. for example, i knew for quite some time i'd be having an orchiectomy "sooner or later" with or without everyone/anyone knowing. i told who i could and whether or not they felt any particular way, i just rationalized it into being their ok to proceed. i don't feel as if i'm deciding, i'm just doing. it is as if someone else is running the ship.

[BillyBlogs (imported)]

Firstly, I know that sense of fear. It's dreadful. Immobilising sometimes. I wish I could give you some magic formula or something to use to make it go away, but I can't. What worked for me, and I really mean worked, was saying what I want out loud to another human. The words "I want to stop having to be a man and living a lie" out loud changed everything for me. Maybe it'll work for you too. It seems ridiculously simple, but for once those gawd awful bumper stickers were right. Magic does happen.

I *think* there's some part of you that's had enough waiting and is moving on into the future, dragging your conscious self along too. But, I'm not any sort of psychologist. I do sense that you're starting to feel a bit like you've been chewed up and spat out twice emotionally, though. I'd really suggest you find someone to help you through this phase in your adventure. It will make the greatest difference, believe you me.

Losing those 'landmarks' on our voyage through life can be very scary indeed. Being autistic, I need rules for just about everything. If there are not, I'll make some up. I spent my life living

up to what I thought were the expectations of the people around me.

Then I moved away and lived alone. All the expectations were gone, and who I am was no longer clearly defined. And this is what I found hardest. This fluid, shifting sense of self. Having good counsel has been the greatest thing.

As I say, I'm not any expert at all. I will say this though. When our inner selves get fed up, they can drive us to do some things. Sometimes weird, sometimes harmful, all manner of stuff. Seeing you have a history of self harm, you know all about depression. I think you should go see someone to make a basic assessment of your mood, and perhaps recommend someone if you need some help. Your general practitioner should be able to make this test.

Another question. Are you on HRT? your mood is very strongly tied to your testosterone/estrogen level, and if that drops dramatically you'll indeed hit a wall. If you are, of course you can ignore this question, but if not, go see your doctor soon.

I would like to be able to offer you more, but this conversation is heading well out of my depth. Try to channel whatever energy you can into finding yourself some professional help.

Billy.

[dee2essohkay (imported)]

Firstly, I know that sense of fear. It's dreadful. Immobilising sometimes. I wish I could give you some magic formula or something to use to make it go away, but I can't. What worked for me, and I really mean worked, was saying what I want out loud to another human. The words "I want to stop having to be a man and living a lie" out loud changed everything for me. Maybe it'll work for you too. It seems ridiculously simple, but for once those gawd awful bumper stickers were right. Magic does happen.

I *think* there's some part of you that's had enough waiting and is moving on into the future, dragging your conscious self along too. But, I'm not any sort of psychologist. I do sense that you're starting to feel a bit like you've been chewed up and spat out twice emotionally, though. I'd really suggest you find someone to help you through this phase in your adventure. It will make the greatest difference, believe you me.

Losing those 'landmarks' on our voyage through life can be very scary indeed. Being autistic, I need rules for just about everything. If there are not, I'll make some up. I spent my life living

up to what I though

t were the expectations of the people around me.

Then I moved away and lived alone. All the expectations were gone, and who I am was no longer clearly defined. And this is what I found hardest. This fluid, shifting sense of self. Having good counsel has been the greatest thing.

As I say, I'm not any expert at all. I will say this though. When our inner selves get fed up, they can drive us to do some things. Sometimes weird, sometimes harmful, all manner of stuff. Seeing you have a history of self harm, you know all about depression. I think you should go see someone to make a basic assessment of your mood, and perhaps recommend someone if you need some help. Your general practitioner should be able to make this test.

Another question. Are you on HRT? your mood is very strongly tied to your testosterone/estrogen level, and if that drops dramatically you'll indeed hit a wall. If you are, of course you can ignore this question, but if not, go see your doctor soon.

I would like to be able to offer you more, but this conversation is heading well out of my depth. Try to channel whatever energy you

can into finding yourself some professional help.

Billy.

hey Billy, you are actually being very helpful. Thanks Much!!! There are some things you are suggesting that I'm already doing but it by no means hurts to hear it some more. I actually have been staying in touch with a trans friend and she has been saying a lot of similar things. Hearing it again from someone else is confirming and i do need that.

The HRT question is the most important i think. I have been planning on starting low dose estrogen. As far as I'm concerned, T is pure mental poison for me. I'll never go near that stuff again. My fear with E is the danger of blood clots which my endocrinologist says can be guarded against. Still at my age and knee and hip problems lately I am concerned that since I tend to get sick and tired of the pain in my legs and just sit or lie down for extended periods, in my mind this increases the danger of the blood clots.

But my endocrinologist is ready to get me started with estrogen as soon as i say lets go ahead. And meantime, I've been struggling to find a new therapist who is well experienced in transgender issues, childhood sexual abuse issues and dissociation. These are areas I need to be working on now. Seems the only ones around do not take insurance and that so far is making getting professional help quite difficult.

I struggled to get the orchi, I just need to struggle some more to get these other things accomplished also. It is great to find people who are supportive. It is not important that you are not a PCP/Psychologist/Endocrinologist. I'm not looking for the letters. You have knowledge and or experience with things i'm going through and it is great to hear about it from your perspective. Thanks again.

Oh here's an edit... i forgot what my last reply was and that it was to you. my getting frozen in my tracks is specifically pertaining to me being open about the surgery i've already had, the surgery I still intend to get and just letting everyone I know realize that I've lived a life I hated simply because it was so uncomfortable and self harming. (yet at the same time I'm grateful to have been able to have kids). I keep saying things that might make people think I regret my successes family-wise, but that is not the case. it is just tying all these things together and not sounding like I don't know what i want, which I've already been accused of, that adds extra fear to "coming out". I'm really dependent on acknowledgement from the people i know in my life. I need that but at the same time its reluctance and terror as if i'm ashamed. yet I can't understand why i feel shame if it just makes my life more difficult and not better.

[BillyBlogs (imported)]

Hi,

Indeed, the sense of shame you feel is not unique to you. I think it stems from us being primates, with a very strong sense of societal bonds. However, in our evolutionary path, we've become just barely smart enough to realise others of our kind can think badly of us. (We might be good a tools, but we're crap at relationships.)

Couple this with a strong desire to reduce everything to simple yes/no - black/white propositions and you have far too many monkeys with far too many opinions on matters they don't have any knowledge about. A lot of these are, I've found, meat-heads who demand the 'right' to express their opinions. Well, they can't have it. They can have the right to hold whatever opinions they want, but they don't have the right to piss in my ear about them to me, thank you very much. Nor constrain me on that basis either.

It's damn hard to escape the constraints we put on ourselves because we think others think of us more than they do, and their judgements are often imagined to be much harsher than is so. You might be pushing into areas where those around you have never entered in their wildest dreams, and here you are "swimming in it", so as to speak. You could be just freaking out the neighbours (a lot), depending on how conservative they are. It could be they who need the patience and understanding.

Oops, sorry, I was getting a bit cranky there.

One thing to keep in mind is you don't have time. That sense of every year being shorter than the last never relents. Become the true you while you can. We suffer from spotlight syndrome too. No one thinks about us anywhere as much as we imagine. I mean, just how truly startled can you be as you walk down the street these days? Few look closely, and even fewer give two hoots.

It's important for humans to get a sense of approval from their peers, but it's much more important to give ourselves approval first. Then we will fall in with those who fit us best.

Another perspective I find invaluable is that we're little biological entities on a weeny little planet in the middle of nowhere, who will last a vanishingly short amount of time. There's nobody 'out there' who could give two knobs of goat shit for what we do. The opinions of the locals are just that, opinions. They're all equally valid, that is, sum to zero.

Do what you want, you're the only person it's going to make a big difference to. Everybody else is just grandstanding on the matter.

Billy.

[dee2essohkay (imported)]

thanks. this is a work in progress. tbc tbd etc. thanks again.