Taking the Plunge.....Again

[plix (imported)]

Living without T it is different, everything you said I think we all have experienced. Make sure you take your calcium and D3, other then that your good to go.

River

I would take those but I have this thing about keeping things natural as much as possible, and taking supplements is something that would go against that. I try to get my calcium from food, and I've heard that certain types of exercise are supposed to help build bone, so I try to do that as well. At my old job I took a couple of bad spills that probably would have broken something if I had bone issues, so I am hopeful things are going OK!

What's really been bothering me lately is that short-term memory loss that I mentioned. I didn't realize how bad it was until just recently, and I'm actually pretty worried about it. It's reached the point where it has impacted my work performance. Now on or off hormones I certainly can't expect my memory to be as good as it was in my teens, but the problems I've noticed seem a bit excessive for my age. Aside from age, something else that could be causing it is

the medication I take for anxiety.

My brother took another medication in the same class, and he strongly suspects it contributed to memory issues he had. But the dose I take is extremely low, so I am not sure if that could really be it. I've also noticed some other mental issues that could be this "brain fog" I have heard others talk about.

As much as I enjoy it, the thought of whether I can really go the rest of my life with no hormones has crossed my mind recently. T is absolutely out of the question, even a small dose, but whether I might do well with some E to combat the fatigue, depression, and mental issues I am experiencing is something I've considered. Taking E is not something that excites me either because I really would rather go with nothing (it's more in line with keeping things natural) and because of the risks of feminization. Plus finding a doctor willing to prescribe it would not be likely given that I am not transgender, so I'd most likely be stuck with the online route, which doesn't thrill me.

But some of these effects are getting very bothersome lately, so I am not sure what to do!

[spinwindy (imported)]

My history in short: I'm male and I'm transgender but I don't identify as female in spite of spending many years thinking that this was my issue. I suffered with gender disphoria but never wanted to lose my meat and two veg. I've sinse gotten rid of my veg surgically but only to permanently get rid of my T without meds. I bounced around with the meds for a few years and during this time worked out what my issue was "testosterone toxicity" http://www.avitale.com/TNote15Testosterone.htm When I read this article it made a lot of sense to me. Anyways I decided I needed a permanent solution so off they came once I found somewhere that would do it. I went to India in the end where it was done in a clinic under general so all good, no dramas apart from losing my luggage and spending my time in India with no personal effects. I continued taking E for some time but decided I didn't like the increased risk of stroke etc so after a time I dropped that as well, next paragraph.

I don't like the idea of supplements or pills come to that, certainly ones that become important to maintaining life as I know it. If I have a headache I take something but I don't like the idea of E, T calcium or similar for the rest of my days. I stopped taking E 6 or 7 months ago and I started having hot flushes after a week or so. I was considering daily the risk of osteoperosis, it's obviously a big worry without any sex hormones. I started reading about the best way to deal with these issues and also to combat some other issues I was having like weight gain which was making me miserable. There is just too much information on the web and it's confusing making sense of it all. I read about drinking pleny of milk for the calcium rather than supplements but I also read studies where it was seen that people who drunk milk actually suffered more bone loss that the study group who did not. There are quite a few studies now that prove this in spite of what the milk marketing board is telling everyone. After some considerable reading I finally came across a book called the starch solution. There are some videos on youtube with the author. He lectures on the benefits of a healthy vegan diet, high starch, plenty of carbs.

Long story short, I read the book adopted the eating habits giving up meat, dairy and fish and I'm about 4 monthe or so into it now. I get my calcium, like the cows from dark green veggies. I don't have to drink the cows milk to get it and I don't need to take supplements. It turns out there's plenty to be had straight from the plants, no mammal digestion necessary and no leaching of calcium from my bones to nuetralise the acidity that comes eating meat or liquid meat that being milk. I eat really well, never hungry because this isn't a diet. I don't miss meat at all not even bacon sandwiches which I loved. The weight has dropped off of me and I'm getting back into jeans that I'd put into storage years ago, I'm getting my body back and my energy and even my strength is now returning with help from weight training which I've always enjoyed. I no longer suffer from the gender disphoria which was the bain of my life for a long time. I suppose these days I am a happy eunuch, no T no E, no supplements and absoluelty no intention of being a prescription slave ever again. I'm probably a bit too enthusiastic about sharing my experience with the veganism but I honestly think it's the answer for a lot of issues that arise from castration. I have a few theories on this after extensive reading most of which I've forgotten.

Depression is something a lot of trans folk and castrated guys seem to suffer and I admit I had a taste of that myself, it's a rough ride. I've come to the conclusion that it's a fairly simple thing to sort out if you're not too buried in it. Anti depressants aren't the answer if it's not too serious. As everybody knows all meds come with a list of side effects and strangely, to me at least, some anti depressants actually increase the risk of suicide, WTF! that doesn't suggest getting better in any measure. There is plenty of proof that exercise works at least "as well" if not better than pills. I think the depression kicks in as a result of the lack of energy and enthusiasm that can occur without any hormones, because of this a lot of activities can slow or stop. To the degree of even venturing outside into the sun and the best source of vitamin which by all accounts is good to combat depression. You can obviously supplement your vitamin D but I'm starting to think that answers don't come in pill pots. Exercising releases the feel good hormones in your brain and will go a considerable way towards getting rid of depression. The hardest thing about exercise is often times just getting past your front door to go for a run or a walk or visit a gym or similar. Once you're out and certainly once you get home, shower and frshen up you'll start to feel better about yourself, I know it really works for me. It can seem like a real chore when you begin but the benefits are well worth the effort. With the exercise you'll also be burning calories and potentially dropping weight. I personally don't agree with the slow metabolism thing a lot of people blame. It strikes me that activity levels drop off as we age or alter our chemicle balance and this is what redues our calorific needs and results in weight gain. The weight gain itself leads to low energy, leads to less activity, leads to weight gain and so on and before you know it you can become a couch potato and from here everything gets worse with other health issues rearing their ugly heads, increasing depression and so on. Plix it would be all too easy to take a little E and it might help but you seem to have been there done that but it doesn't quite cut it. If as you say you'd rather keep things natural focus on that, exercise, eat well by dropping meat dairy and fish and you might be pleasantly surprised, nothing to lose, everything to gain. No side effects aside from better health, more stamina, more strength, increased bone density better frame of mind, increased confidence, it's a win win. Hope this helps or is at least food for thought, best wishes

[spinwindy (imported)]

PS

Hot flushes: my own experience with them has been quite short and I think this has been as a result of my dropping a fair amount of weight. Even without the flushes I definitely noticed that I sweated a lot more when I was carrying more weight, it's horrible! I noticed it in bed at night just laying still trying to sleep but sweating where ever one part of my body touched another. I noticed it when I exerted myself either at work or when doing any exercise. As a result I was reluctant to exert myself, my activity decreased and so did my weight. All of these nagatives feed off of each other. I was doing less, becoming bored easily, eating more to combat the boredom, gaining more weight and on it was going, all negative, all leading potentially to bad health and probable bad state of mind. If I have hot flushes these days and I suspect that on occasion I might, they are barely noticable to the point I can easily ignore them and they aren't an issue.

Something else whilst I think of it. If moobs are an issue dropping weight, specifically body fat will also help to reduce them. I was considering going under the knife to get rid of mine but I'm starting to think now that this won't be necessary. I've been wearing shirts with double pockets with a T shirt underneath to disguise this issue but I can't stand shirts. I long to get back into T shirts only, far more relaxed, far more me.

[daifu-orchid (imported)]

Hang in there! There are many here who have had times when life was down. There is nothing easy about the eunuch state, adaptations, consequences and not all are easy to handle. Seems you have some good things going for you, even if it doesn't seem like it: basic good health, exercise, varied vegan diet, and some time to figure out how to deal with some of the challenges. The other Trump Card is the resource of the good folks at EA who always have an ear at the ready to help.

[plix (imported)]

spinwindy: Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts and experiences!

There was once a time I identified as female, but it was brief. I'm certainly not your stereotypical male, but I also don't necessarily identify as transgender. If someone asked me what I am, I'd probably say male.

What you mentioned is a lot of why I really don't want to take E. I don't want to be dependent on taking it for the rest of my life.

I was actually vegetarian for the last couple of years but went back to eating meat just last week. Since my reasons were mostly ethical, it was a painful decision, but I was actually worried that the lack of meat was negatively impacting my health. You are a brave soul for going vegan! In my case vegetarianism was tough enough, and I could never see going that far! Diet is an interesting thing. It seems like for every book out there saying why a particular diet is the way to go, there are three more books saying why that diet is wrong and a different one is right. And studies are even more interesting. It seems like every week there is a new study coming out saying that eating this increases your risk of that while eating that decreases your risk of this. Way too much to keep up with for me! My plan is to just stick with eating as many foods as I can that have been traditionally accepted as healthy.

Yes, depression is something that I deal with from time to time. In my case not working definitely appears to be a trigger, and my most recent bout was when I had an extended break due to the holiday this last weekend. I'm worried about the longer break coming up later this month, and of course summer seems to be the worst, at least this last one was. I was on T during last year's summer, and while I missed work, I seemed to get through it OK. This last summer, when I was off T, depression seemed to strike me a lot worse.

When it does hit, it can get bad, but no matter how bad it gets I will never touch antidepressants! I already hate having to take this medication for anxiety so much and would love to be off of it, but I also know that due to how bad my anxiety can get (and I tolerate anxiety a lot less well than depression), it is not something that is feasible right now.

I'm actually pretty active just during my natural day since I am almost always on my feet at work. Sitting down outside of lunch is pretty unusual for me. But I don't really get any "official" exercise outside of the evening walks that aren't so common for me at this time of year since I don't really like walking at night, and I would imagine you are right when you suggest that could help.

Yes, I have been down the E road before I can never seem to remember exactly what it was like to be on it whenever I am not taking it, but from what I have posted here, E seems to carry emotional baggage of its own. I had some wonderful highs when taking it, but there were also some pretty deep lows. I know that taking E is not really something I want to do because even though I would obviously keep my hair short and have a very masculine facial structure, I still think feminization would not be a good idea. But with what I have been experiencing lately, I wonder if it is something I will eventually have to do.

While I could do without the depression, so far I have managed to get through it when it does hit. The fatigue is generally mild - while I know that I feel tired, it doesn't really impair my functioning. But every so often it does seem to hit harder. Just last week I was walking around a mall and was feeling very tired. It became progressively worse, and eventually it was so bad I had to sit down. Once I was down, I had no desire to get up! The cognitive issues have me a lot more worried lately, especially over the long term. I'm also concerned about osteoporosis.

I haven't experienced a single hot flush since stopping T this time. During past experiments there were a few times I thought I might be experiencing some very mild ones, but since nothing happened this time I am doubting that is what those incidents were. I suppose that is one effect I just don't have to deal with!

I do have a bit of breast development, mostly from past times taking E, but it is very small and only noticeable when I wear certain shirts. I don't think too much of it is fat in my case. I'm not as thin as I used to be, but most people would still probably call me on the thin side. If I were to take E for an extended period, surgery to get rid of it may be a goal of mine (that would eliminate the main aspect of feminization that I think could cause problems), but I will probably be OK if I stay on nothing.

Thanks again for sharing! I hope you continue to experience many of the wonders that life as a eunuch has to offer

[plix (imported)]

Lately I have been wondering whether I have been successful up to this point in my life. I suppose the answer to that question depends on how you want to define success. Well, if you want to define it in terms of financial prosperity, the answer in my case is clearly no. It's kind of strange though because most people who knew me growing up predicted that I would be financially successful. My grades, especially in the first half of my schooling career, were quite high. In high school they did slip a bit due to declining motivation settling in, but they were still good. This sort of academic achievement would seem to increase the likelihood of financial success later in life, but I suspect the low motivation is why things didn't turn out that way for me. But my low motivation is something that could easily fill a post of its own, so I won't go further into that this time

But I'm not so sure that for me success is that simple. I still haven't figured out exactly what I think success is, but lately I have wondered if perhaps part what I consider to be success is having a family. One of my recent fears is that a big deathbed regret of mine is going to be that I never had a family.

I have been looking at men who appear to be around my age and noticing how they are with their families and wondering if that might be who I am supposed to be. In Ohio I am surrounded by a lot of this since people out here tend to get married much earlier than people in California, and it doesn't seem like there are too many single people my age. I notice how masculine-looking these men are and wonder if perhaps I am lacking something there as well. Men my age look quite a bit different from how I do, which is almost certainly a result of their bodies being exposed to T for a number of years and my body not having this exposure.

Of course I know I am a different person from that other me who I could have been. This other guy was never castrated and had T all these last eight years. I imagine he would be different in some ways. Of course he would look different. But I also think he could otherwise be different. He probably would never have moved to Ohio or even from one place in California to another. He may have found his way into a relationship by now (one that would have been right for his sexual orientation). He could be following a different career path. He would have crossed paths with people he will now never know and would not have crossed paths with many people who are a part of his life now.

But at the same time, I tend to think I am the me I was meant to be. This other guy does not exist except as a theoretical possibility that could have been but is not. It's interesting to think about how one choice we make in life can dramatically alter the rest of its course, but since I believe that life plays out the way it is supposed to, I also believe that the choices we make are the ones we were supposed to make. Just why I made this choice 8 ½ years ago I don't know for certain yet, but I expect the answer will become clearer to me as I grow older.

Back to my fears that I will regret never having a family. I have to admit it is looking less likely for me with the passing of each day. I am almost 30 years old now, and as I mentioned, it seems that most people my age are already married with a family. Complicating the situation even more is that I am not taking T. It seems less likely a woman would be interested in a man who has no T in his system, considering the changes in appearance and functionality that result.

Of course I am afraid I will regret it someday, but my guess is that it would not be wise to let that dominate my life. Surely there are other things that can contribute to personal success, and I need to figure out what else can bring me happiness and the feeling that I have been successful.

[tugon (imported)]

Plix, my friend, you do know you are the only one saying that you can not have what you want. I know you are unable to fertilize an egg but there are so many more ways to parent. You and I have both decided things about ourselves that limits us in our dreams. I am the first to say relationships can be tough. In all the time I have known you having one would bring you great joy. There are many unconventional relationships today that I wonder if they outnumber the conventional relationships.

There are some women that for multiple reasons do not want a macho man. They may have been victims of domestic violence, sexual assault or child abuse. I am not saying find yourself a fixer upper but you are some woman's dream. When you meet her and find comfort with one another life will be sweet. Unbeknownst to you 8 1/2 years ago you may have made yourself exactly the person for which your dream is looking.

[daifu-orchid (imported)]

More TG wisdom, indeed. It is wonderful to find that what one might think of as trivial, turns out to have been the world to someone your know, -or don't yet. Hang in there, man, she thinks the world of you.

[plix (imported)]

tugon and daifu-orchid: thanks so much for your kind thoughts!

Why is it, I wonder, that people always seem to think of me as gay? This is an issue I have dealt with for much of my life. Of course, back when I was growing up I did have a bit of fascination with telling people I was gay, so I would imagine that probably didn't help But it's not like it was something I was constantly telling people. It just happened a couple of times. Once when I was in sixth grade I told a male classmate that I was gay, and I will never forget the way his eyes looked after I said that - they were full of pure terror. I also told a few friends that I was gay in high school, and one of them told me that everyone had already assumed that. But why?

Later that same friend reminded me that it was widely believed that I was gay. I heard that a girl was interested in going to the prom with me under the assumption that I was gay. I would imagine she felt comfortable going with me because she thought I was gay and didn't think I was going to try anything.

This same assumption has carried over to my adult life. At the place I worked over the summer, one of my co-workers was talking about wanting to set me up with her nephew. I never said anything to anybody at this job about being gay. One of the rumors going around about me last year at my current job was that I am gay.

Just last week a 5th grade student I was working with asked me if I am gay. A couple of years ago a 1st grader came up to me and said, "My sister said you're gay." His sister was an older student I had worked with. From the look on his face and the tone of his voice you could tell that my alleged gayness was something he was very worried about.

It's strange because I'm not really flamboyant at all. In fact, I am pretty much the opposite of flamboyant. So what in the world could be causing people to think I'm gay?

The interesting thing is that when I am on T, I am exclusively attracted to women. Things seem to get a bit trickier when I am off T. I can sometimes, though not often, feel attracted to men. I am still predominantly straight but with a slight bisexual side when I am not taking T.

[Uncle Flo (imported)]

My superficial observation is that people assume someone is gay if he is different from their expectations of a hetro male in any significant way particularly if he is quiet and projects a "soft" personal image. --FLO--

[plix (imported)]

Uncle Flo: I would guess you're right

This isn't really all that surprising, but lately questions of gender have been coming up for me again. This seems to happen from time to time whenever I am not taking T.

Many of us know that my original reason for being castrated was because I wanted to transition to female. I went pretty far with that transition. In fact, I was only three days away from legally changing my name. I had filed my name change with the court and just needed to attend the hearing. A few days before the hearing I went to the newspaper I was running the announcement in, and one of the staff members there was the only reason I backed away from my plan. I was presenting female, although due to my fashion sense (one way in which I am stereotypically masculine, I suppose ) I looked more like a grandmother than a 20 year-old woman. I was also using my "female" voice, which was clearly a man trying to sound like a woman. When this guy was talking to me, he seemed to intentionally throw in and put extra emphasis on the word "sir" at the end of everything he said to me. Now this was a religious-based newspaper, so you couldn't expect him to approve of what I was doing, but I had hoped to be treated at least a little more respectfully.

I ended up going home and crying for an hour. I then went down to the courthouse, dressed as a man (and that time would be the last I would ever present as female), and cancelled the case. I accepted that I wasn't passable, and that even if at that point I still believed I was trans, it wasn't yet time to make the switch.

That guy remains one of the biggest jerks I've ever met in my life, but at the same time I do owe him a debt because he prevented me from making a big mistake.

Of course it wasn't too much later when I came to the conclusion that I am in fact not trans, and I abandoned all plans for transition.

In a recent post I said that I "probably" identify as male. What did I mean by "probably?" What kind of guy would say that he is "probably" male? Most guys know without a doubt that they are male, right?

One of the big reasons I don't believe that I can trans is because as a child I never felt uncomfortable with my gender. It was clear that I was different and did not fit in, but I don't once remember thinking that my gender was the issue. Sure, there were some less-than-manly incidents during my childhood:

- My grandmother tells me that when I was 3, we were shopping and I pointed out a girl's shirt and said I wanted it.

- I played mostly with girls during my childhood, and almost all of my close friends were girls.

- I had a Polly Pocket, and it was one of my favorite toys.

- I really wanted an easy-bake oven.

- I thought those Lisa Frank folders were very pretty and wanted one.

But do these things make me female? Of course not. While I preferred playing with girls and liked some girly things, I don't recall ever thinking that I was a girl or even that I wasn't a boy. I also don't remember jumping up and down while shouting "Yippee! I'm a boy!" But I would imagine that is true for most cisgender people - we simply don't think about gender much.

My first transgender feelings started when I was 19. I was browsing the Internet that summer and came across the transgender community. I started thinking "Maybe this is it. This is why you never fit in. This is why you felt uncomfortable as a child. It was because you are really a woman." Now I am not a quick decision maker. I generally prefer to think about my options long and hard before I decide what to do. But once I have made a decision, things get a lot different. I suddenly become very hasty with implementing that decision. There really isn't any way to stop me once I have decided I am going to do something. That is pretty much what happened with transition. I decided I was going to do it, and things fell into place very quickly. It wasn't long before I was seeing a therapist to get approved for hormones. When the therapist didn't work out, I called Dr. Kimmel and scheduled my surgery.

The interesting thing is that

just a few weeks ago (when I made the post saying I was "probably" male) I was regretting not looking more masculine. Now things have shifted, and I suddenly want to look more androgynous. I don't really want to look feminine, but I wouldn't be opposed to looking more androgynous than what I do now. I think a lot of this is because I want people to see what I feel inside. I want to be able to say "See? I'm not a normal guy, so stop expecting me to act like one!"

Of course deep down I know that I'm male, and that it is my gender expression rather than gender identity that is the issue. Since I am a man, people seem to expect me to think, feel, and act in certain ways, and I'm just not always comfortable with that. One of the things that really bothers me is that because I'm a man, I'm not supposed to enjoy working with children, and if I do, then I must have sinister reasons for it.

So what does this all mean? Does it mean I go back to taking T, since I generally don't worry about these things as much when I am on it? Of course not. I love being without T, and I'm not giving that up. Does it mean that I should pursue my desires for some degree of physical change? Probably not that either, since we know how things work with me. Next week I could be back to regretting the loss of masculinity again.

But why is it that I can only say "probably" male, and not definitely?

[Milkman (imported)]

Plix,

What a thoughtful, honest post... Maybe you should not try to force yourself into either of the standard binarny male, female roles... You are in between at this point as perhaps being a eunuch is all of the physical change you need

[daifu-orchid (imported)]

Not quite sure where this fits, but.... Generally I identify as hetero male, while on T. Occasionally in the past I have stopped the T while having urological surgery, and quickly noticed that others treated me differently. I was aware of losing the male skin grease and odor, and have often wondered how much that or the other maybe subtle body-language cues bring the differences in social interaction about. This raises the question that perhaps I function as two rather different people, one while on T and the other when not. So losing the nuts may bring a welcome change, but maybe one needs to consider that it may mean being a different person, not just a happier version of the man before?

There are Great Minds here to guide us through this homespun muddled psych, I hope...

[plix (imported)]

Milkman and daifu-orchid: Thanks so much for sharing!

Milkman: You bring up an interesting idea. Lately I have actually been feeling like I might be somewhere in between genders. A friend pointed out that I might be "genderfluid," and this is something I have been thinking about as well. We all know how back and forth I am with this sort of thing, and it possible that my gender identity doesn't stay in just one place. Being a eunuch has done interesting things to me mentally, but physically while it has done some things like skin softening and some body hair reduction, I still definitely look like a man, so I don't know if in the long term the physical changes will be enough, but a lot of it probably depends on what kind of answers I come up with for these gender questions I am having.

daifu-orchid: Yes, I think the hormonal changes I have experienced probably have a lot to do with why I am feeling this way lately. I also identified as a hetero male when on T (though I didn't adhere to traditional male gender role expectations and felt like I was more feminine than your average guy). Also, I recently started taking phytoestrogens in the form of herbs to see if it would help with some of the more unwanted effects of castration like low energy and cognitive decline (and yes, I'm aware this is a violation of my anti-supplement leanings ). Now, the trans community says that these things have no effect whatsoever, but you also have to keep in mind that generally it is someone with full T who experiments with them. I've always thought they would work at least a little better for eunuchs. Anyway, I think this gender questioning has increased since I started the phytoestrogens a few weeks ago. I'm basically wondering just how much these herbs might be messing with my mind. I guess I could stop taking them to see if I feel solidly male again, but I kind of like what has happened and would really rather not stop. Plus, I think the herbs might be why I have been weathering this time off work surprisingly well. I expected to be way more depressed than this. Not only I have not experienced any significant bouts of depression, but there have been times when I have actually been pretty happy.

I was recently looking at my kindergarten class pictures. Everyone except me and one other boy was smiling. I had a very serious expression on my face and my trademark look of sadness in my eyes - that same look in my eyes that I had in many pictures taken of me when I was growing up. I can't explain it exactly, but I just look at my eyes in those pictures and see sadness inside of them. I was looking at some of the smiling girls beside me and wondering to myself if I would have been smiling if I was a girl. I was wondering if I would have liked wearing the clothes they were wearing, if maybe they were who I was supposed to be.

I still don't think I'm actually female. For that to be true (and please be aware that I am not commenting on other people's cases, just on my own!), I think there would have to be some evidence in early childhood - some incident where I thought or said I was a girl. As far as I can remember, that just didn't happen.

But lately it has become clear to me that I am not a normal man, and it's reached the point where I am now starting to feel like I might be something other than male (even though I don't think it's female). Sure, there are a lot of feminine men out there, and they are still men. But where exactly does the line get drawn? Just how feminine can a man be before he becomes something other than male?

In my case, there are a great deal of feminine qualities. But it's not just the qualities. It's also that my ring and index fingers are the same length. It's also something I've talked about before, that being my tendency to always write from female viewpoints when I used to do creative writing. This felt more natural to me, and I just couldn't see

writing from a male viewpoint.

It's also that when I was growing up, I read a lot of books that were probably targeted to girls, and I felt connected to these female narrators. I remember once I was visiting my aunt and cousins, and my female cousin had the book "Are You There God? It's Me, Margaret." I wanted to read the book, but my grandmother wouldn't let me because she said it wasn't appropriate for boys, and I was very upset about that.

All of these things have me wondering if I can really be completely male. Is that possible? Can a man so strongly identify with the feminine, and yet still be wholly male? Another thing I have observed is that I relate much better to the female students I work with than to the male students. I once told a friend I work with about this (one who I trusted not to turn it against me), and she said it wasn't normal and that I had to be careful saying that. I told her about the subject matter that tends to make up the conversations boys have and that I couldn't relate to those conversations. She said most guys would not only be able to relate to that sort of thing but would also enjoy talking about it.

As I mentioned, I am taking phyto E and am now seriously considering taking the real thing. It scares me for a lot of different reasons, but at the same time it is something I want to do. But will my identify shift even more if I start taking E?

[daifu-orchid (imported)]

First-hand, I know only how T or no T changes me. I have never experimented with herbals, but understand that they are not expected to be as powerful as prescription meds from the doc. So do I think your identity will shift more? Probably with real E. Is it a good thing? Only you can decide after a trial.

[tugon (imported)]

I have been reading and rereading your post. "Today you are You, that is truer than true. There is no one alive who is Youer than You." Yes I needed the help of Dr. Seuss to respond to your post. What you may perceive as flaws some of us see as attributes. Feminine no but kind and gentle yes. I am sure children are very comfortable with you and that is why you are a success in your profession.

Instead of worrying about where you fit enjoy fitting in everywhere. I was ready to be a eunuch when castrated at 41 and even though you thought you wanted to transition to feminine you may grow into the eunuch role in time. You may have just put the cart before the horse. I always respected you for not living with regrets. Yes you are still questioning but not regretful.

I know it will be a time before you can relax and enjoy yourself but trust me it does come. In the meantime enjoy your gender whims. If you are feeling masculine celebrate that and as a eunuch enjoy watching men and women from that in the middle perspective or feminine take a bubble bath or like I wrap a feminine scarf around my neck and take my dog for a walk.

We are living our lives and this is not dress rehearsal.

[plix (imported)]

First-hand, I know only how T or no T changes me. I have never experimented with herbals, but understand that they are not expected to be as powerful as prescription meds from the doc. So do I think your identity will shift more? Probably with real E. Is it a good thing? Only you can decide after a trial.

That's one of the things that really scares me. What if I start to feel too feminine after taking E? Would that be a good thing? I just don't know. And the possibility of it being a good thing is also something that scares me. What if I like the effects of E a little too much? The other big fear is that I will experience feminization that becomes too noticeable at work,

but I'm hoping just taking a low dose would prevent that.

I have been reading and rereading your post. "Today you are You, that is truer than true. There is no one alive who is Youer than You." Yes I needed the help of Dr. Seuss to respond to your post. What you may perceive as flaws some of us see as attributes. Feminine no but kind and gentle yes. I am sure children are very comfortable with you and that is why you are a success in your profession.

Instead of worrying about where you fit enjoy fitting in everywhere. I was ready to be a eunuch when castrated at 41 and even though you thought you wanted to transition to feminine you may grow into the eunuch role in time. You may have just put the cart before the horse. I always respected you for not living with regrets. Yes you are still questioning but not regretful.

I know it will be a time before you can relax and enjoy yourself but trust me it does come. In the meantime enjoy your gender whims. If you are feeling masculine celebrate that and as a eunuch enjoy watching men and women from that in the middle perspective or feminine take a bubble bath or like I wrap a feminine scarf around my neck and take my dog for a wal

k.

We are living our lives and this is not dress rehearsal.

Thanks so much for offering some advice!

Someone else recently told me that I am way more feminine than the average straight guy. I guess a lot of it really depends on how you define "feminine." A lot of people would consider "gentle" to be a "feminine" trait. But maybe there is a difference between the two. I wonder, what do you think the difference between "gentle" and "feminine" is?

In any case, I really don't see myself as being female, but I am recognizing that I have a strong feminine side (at least it seems "feminine" to me), and I am becoming more open-minded to the possibility that I may not be 100% male. Like you said, I can probably fit in in a lot of different places, and for the time being I don't intend to apply just one label to myself.

I'm not sure how familiar everyone is with Myers-Briggs personality theory, but it something I am pretty interested in, and this interest is supposed to be common for people with my type. There are other models of personality theory out there that some say are better, but I never understood myself until I came across this one, so I absolutely love it! Basically there are 16 different personality types, and each type has a four-letter name. My type comes out as INFP. This is supposed to be a really feminine type. One website describes INFP as "most definitely a female type." It is consistently rated among the most feminine types when people talk about this sort of thing. So I've also been wondering if maybe this explains it. Maybe I'm just a man who has been cursed with having a female personality type. My being INFP could explain the connection to the feminine side of things. But if that's true, then I've also been thinking that maybe there is something like a woman inside of me. I still wouldn't actually be a woman, but if I have a female personality type, then there would be something "womanlike" inside of me. I can't explain it exactly, but it makes sense to me, anyway. For some reason that made me pretty happy to think about.

I also wonder if maybe INFPs would be more OK with castration and maybe even taking E than other guys would be. Most guys would freak out over that sort of thing, but maybe INFPs could tolerate it. I know in my case I haven't really regretted my surgery, at least not for any extended period of time. Of course it doesn't seem like most INFP males are going out and having their balls cut off or are taking E, so maybe it is just weirdness that is specific to me!

Looking back, it does seem like I function better on hormones than I do without. Since I love being without T, E is my only other option. Man or woman or something else, I think a case could be made that taking E would not be a bad thing if it helps me get rid of the problems that castration causes for me.

[daifu-orchid (imported)]

The considering of the place, on the M - F scale seems to be causing anguish. I rather think Tugon has it right; you are you -right now. It may be that it turns out to be rather more to the M or the F, but as an E, one has the luxury of enjoying them all without actually owning either identity. While I know that T has a profound effect on how I see the world, so does much other happenstance. Maybe it's another advantage of the eunuch state, but I don't get upset or troubled by it; there's actually more to enjoy.

There's another question in the post, how others, particularly at work perceive one. Some folks are sufficiently hard-boiled that it doesn't matter, but most I think are more sensitive. So, I suspect that the situation really comes down to taking E makes you feel good, but known consequences would in some measure cause unwelcome comment at work. So often, our personal preferences must be balanced with our place in the world. I wish I could help more, but I cannot know how it feels for you to be on E, or your circumstance at work. If the question is important enough to you, you need to find your own answer, though friends can always lend support and even maybe some help?

[tugon (imported)]

Someone else recently told me that I am way more feminine than the average straight guy. I guess a lot of it really depends on how you define "feminine." A lot of people would consider "gentle" to be a "feminine" trait. But maybe there is a difference between the two. I wonder, what do you think the difference between "gentle" and "feminine" is?

I also wonder if maybe INFPs would be more OK with castration and maybe even taking E than other guys would be. Most guys would freak out over that sort of thing, but maybe INFPs could tolerate it. I know in my case I haven't really regretted my surgery, at least not for any extended period of time. Of course it doesn't seem like most INFP males are going out and having their balls cut off or are taking E, so maybe it is just weirdness that is specific to me!

Looking back, it does seem like I function better on hormones than I do without. Since I love being without T, E is my only other option. Man or woman or something else, I think a case could be made that taking E would not be a bad thing if it helps me get rid of the problems that castration causes for me.

How to define gentle? How to define feminine? Your movements and how you carry yourself seemed male. Your shyness and interaction with others seemed gentle. Remember how much my dog liked you? Dogs are a good judge of character and Corky took to you right away. He did not perceive you as an aggressive being. Someone with too much T would be off putting to him.

I think sometimes you send out mixed messages. Even though I had never perceived you as gay you had said you were. When you confided you were straight I had to erase old knowledge to accept this new information. I think when you finally accept yourself as you are in anyway that may be it will be easier for others to accept you. I remember a time, after all my struggles to find myself, a friend said to me that I was so comfortable in my own skin. This was said with a little envy and I did not want to get into how hard fought it was to get to that point.

I think becoming comfortable with yourself is also a product of aging. You reach a point where you accept yourself and are comfortable with who you are. Much of what you are feeling and struggling with many people without our issues also struggle with in life. I will be 58 this Spring and many of the things I struggled with when I was your age are no longer an issue. You will find yourself the least bit concerned about what someone may think of you.

Instead of trying to find out where you should be enjoy where you are. Sit and look within yourself and figure out what you like about you. Do not think about what you may not have. What you may not have may come in time. Learn yourself in the minute and not from past experiences or future dreams. Your wants may come and your past cannot be changed.

[plix (imported)]

The considering of the place, on the M - F scale seems to be causing anguish. I rather think Tugon has it right; you are you -right now. It may be that it turns out to be rather more to the M or the F, but as an E, one has the luxury of enjoying them all without actually owning either identity. While I know that T has a profound effect on how I see the world, so does much other happenstance. Maybe it's another advantage of the eunuch state, but I don't get upset or troubled by it; there's actually more to enjoy.

There's another question in the post, how others, particularly at work perceive one. Some folks are sufficiently hard-boiled that it doesn't matter, but most I think are more sensitive. So, I suspect that the situation really comes down to taking E makes you feel good, but known consequences would in some measure cause unwelcome comment at work. So often, our personal preferences must be balanced with our place in the world. I wish I could help more, but I cannot know how it feels for you to be on E, or your circumstance at work. If the question is important enough to you, you need to find your own answer, though friends can always lend support and even maybe some help?

Well, something that is unique to my job is that I have the ability to work at a difference place every day. I have worked at the same place for most of the last couple of years, but I could be working somewhere different on a daily basis if I really wanted to. I've been thinking about which situation would be worse. I could work at the same place, but people there might notice that something has changed about me. I could work at different places, but I will encounter strangers on a daily basis, and they might think I look a bit strange for a guy. I guess each prob

ably has its pros and cons

Thanks for your support!

How to define gentle? How to define feminine? Your movements and how you carry yourself seemed male. Your shyness and interaction with others seemed gentle. Remember how much my dog liked you? Dogs are a good judge of character and Corky took to you right away. He did not perceive you as an aggressive being. Someone with too much T would be off putting to him.

I think sometimes you send out mixed messages. Even though I had never perceived you as gay you had said you were. When you confided you were straight I had to erase old knowledge to accept this new information. I think when you finally accept yourself as you are in anyway that may be it will be easier for others to accept you. I remember a time, after all my struggles to find myself, a friend said to me that I was so comfortable in my own skin. This was said with a little envy and I did not want to get into how hard fought it was to get to that point.

I think becoming comfortable with yourself is also a product of aging. You reach a point where you accept yourself and are comfortable with who you are. Much of what you are feeling and struggling with many people without our issues also struggle with in life. I will be 58 this Spring and many of the things I struggled with when I was your age are no longer an issue. You will find yourself the least bit concerned about what someone may think of you.

Instead of trying to find out where you should be enjoy where you are. Sit and look within yourself and figure out what you like about you. Do not think about what you may not have. What you may not have may come in time. Learn yourself in the minute and not from past experiences or future

dreams. Your wants may come and your past cannot be changed.

It seems to me that we are probably defining feminine a bit differently. Nothing wrong with that though I'm thinking more in terms of traits rather than how I move or carry myself. Since I was socialized male, I would expect my way of doing those things to be male. And certainly my flat affect has the tendency to come across as male. It projects that "rugged, stoic male" image that society often associates with men. A friend of mine in high school once called me her "most unemotional" friend. Ha! She has no idea what emotions I have felt on the inside

I do think that I am probably male, just one who has had the misfortune of being born with a female personality type. I've known about Myers-Briggs and being INFP for years, but I only discovered recently that it is considered a "female" personality type. I can't accept that I am a 100% normal male and could still have such a strong identification with the feminine, but thinking of myself as a man with a female personality type has brought me a lot of peace for now

Thanks again for sharing your thoughts

[daifu-orchid (imported)]

Emotion is not a bad thing, just an excess of it can get in the way of life rather than enhance it.

Seems from the safety of ignorance at a great distance, that taking E matches your personality, makes you feel good, but you're worried about work. If as you say, the work involves interacting with many people, a little heightening of the affect with E might even help? So, my 2 cents worth is to go with the E and enjoy how you feel and the benefit to work too. (What's a little A-cup between friends anyway! Probably most wouldn't even notice?)

[tugon (imported)]

I do think that I am probably male, just one who has had the misfortune of being born with a female personality type. I've known about Myers-Briggs and being INFP for years, but I only discovered recently that it is considered a "female" personality type. I can't accept that I am a 100% normal male and could still have such a strong identification with the feminine, but thinking of myself as a man with a female personality type has brought me a lot of peace for now

Thanks again for sharing your thoughts

A psychologist friend of mine wanted me to take the Myers-Briggs personality test and after reading what you have learned about it I wished I had. Again for me is it nature or nurture because I have always more closely related to feminine emotions. I was also more attracted to straight men than to gay men. Was it the lack of a male role model and the influence from my mother and older sister or something with which I was born? Of course it may be that part of your brain did masculinize and part feminized. I read about the troubles feminine straight men had meeting women because it was easily assumed they were gay. Some folks' brains do not agree with their bodies and it may be that parts of your brain do not agree with other parts. Wow that does not sound like much help.

You mentioned your flat affect and so much of what I write is supposition due to not having a clear understanding of who you are.

[plix (imported)]

Emotion is not a bad thing, just an excess of it can get in the way of life rather than enhance it.

Seems from the safety of ignorance at a great distance, that taking E matches your personality, makes you feel good, but you're worried about work. If as you say, the work involves interacting with many people, a little heightening of the affect with E might even help? So, my 2 cents worth is to go with the E and enjoy how you feel and the benefit to work too. (What's a little A-cup between friends anyway! Probably most wouldn't even notice?)

Sometimes my emotions can feel a little overwhelming to me! It's like I know logically speaking that I should be looking at something a certain way, but

in some situations the tug of my heart is just too strong!

A psychologist friend of mine wanted me to take the Myers-Briggs personality test and after reading what you have learned about it I wished I had. Again for me is it nature or nurture because I have always more closely related to feminine emotions. I was also more attracted to straight men than to gay men. Was it the lack of a male role model and the influence from my mother and older sister or something with which I was born? Of course it may be that part of your brain did masculinize and part feminized. I read about the troubles feminine straight men had meeting women because it was easily assumed they were gay. Some folks' brains do not agree with their bodies and it may be that parts of your brain do not agree with other parts. Wow that does not sound like much help.

You mentioned your flat affect and so much of what I write is supposi

tion due to not having a clear understanding of who you are.

No, you have actually been very helpful! What you shared is making so much sense to me right now!

Don't worry. I don't really have a clear understanding of who I am either. But yes, what people see on the outside is only a small part of who I really am.

When it comes to most nature vs. nurture questions, I tend to think the answer is a little of both.

Well, it's official! I'm now taking E again. So my current run with no hormones is now over at about 13 1/2 months. Unless you consider taking phyto E to be taking hormones, in which case it was over sooner. I am taking 2 mg of estradiol valerate. I wanted the regular estradiol, but Inhouse didn't have it when I ordered. So far I am feeling very at peace with this decision. I'm also feeling scared and excited. I am feeling so many different things right now!

I am keeping my hair short, and that combined with my very masculine face should allow me to take E for as long as I like and still pass as a guy, so that doesn't really worry me, but one of the things that does scare me is eventually becoming a man with breasts. I'm not afraid of breasts themselves, but I am worried about social issues they could cause. But I am a little comforted by the knowledge that during past experiments with E, including injectable E, I never really got that much in the way of boobs, just some budding. Then again, I've also never taken E consistently for longer than six months, so it's hard to say for sure what is going to happen.

A friend did tell me that even with just the budding, a few people noticed back then, which is why I am still kind of worried. I know that when I look in the bathroom mirror at work, my nipples do seem to puff out a bit too much for someone as skinny as I am, so it is possible people have already noticed and just haven't said anything.

One interesting thing I have noticed is that over the last couple of nights, I have been remembering so many details from dreams. My dream recall used to be excellent, but lately it hasn't been so hot. I might be able to remember a snippet at best, and sometimes just a feeling or a place that I was at, but nothing else. Not over the last couple of nights! I am remembering so much more all of a sudden. It's pretty cool to think about all of the ways that hormones affect out bodies and minds.

An interesting thing happened a couple of days ago. I was out with some friends from work, and one of them told me that I should have been a woman. It's actually kind of silly when you think about the context in which she said it, and it probably doesn't mean anything. Basically we were talking about drink preferences, and I guess my favorite drinks are "girly" according to what she said. After I told her all of them, she said "You should have been a woman." Of course she didn't mean it seriously, and I just laughed when she said that, but inside I was thinking maybe she was onto something. Maybe I should have been a woman. I'm a man of course (even though I am feeling not so male lately, my logical side is saying yes, you are male), and there is no changing that, but maybe I should have been a woman. I've always thought that if I had been born a girl, I would have been OK with it. At the least, I don't think I would have been FTM.

I'm still trying to figure out exactly where this shift came from. It happened about a month ago around the time when I started taking phyto E. Up until then I was regretting losing all the masculinization that I could have had and identifying with men who had families. Now I feel like I'm somewhere in between and am excited about taking E (even though at this point, it's still mostly from the perspective of reversing negative effects of castration). What in the world is going on? Are hormones really that powerful that they can change our very identities?

[plix (imported)]

I'm back to being a eunuch for a number of different reasons. Probably the most important of these is that I have started to see physical changes in myself, and it is pretty likely that if I can see them, others can as well. A friend of mine (the same friend who said that I should have been a woman) told me that I do not look like a "typical male." When I asked her what she meant, she told me that I look "nerdy," but while I probably do look that way, I really don't think that is what she was getting at. How do you tell a guy that he looks feminine? She also told me that my not looking typical could cause me problems at work, especially if I decided to branch out to more rural areas as I told her was one of my wishes. Recently I had a dream where I received a letter from work telling me they were concerned because they could see there was something different about me. After I read the letter, I asked myself what was more important to me - taking E or my job. The answer of course is very clear to me.

It is a shame that I decided to stop taking E because I do feel that it did some good things for my affect. A (different) friend recently told me that he didn't think I'd be able to talk if I didn't have my hands. I have noticed that I use my hands a lot more when talking now.

Another major factor in my decision is that, surprisingly, E managed to give me a libido boost. I wasn't expecting this at all since I thought E was supposed to reduce or eliminate male-type libido. The boost actually started with what I might call a female-like libido (but I can't say for sure since I don't really know how it feels when a woman is attracted to someone). Not only was the direction toward guys (not all guys, but I have definitely felt very attracted to certain guys since starting E), but there was also something "different" about how it felt compared to feeling attracted to women when on T. With T the sign of attraction is of course an erection, but this was something that sort of spread throughout my entire body. If it had ended there, I might have been OK, but eventually a male-type libido came back along with it. Somehow the old male feelings and functioning returned, although I will never understand how since I was taking E, and everything I have ever read seems to indicate the exact opposite happens when biological males take E. Since stopping E, the male-type libido has diminished, although as recently as yesterday I still experience remnants of the female-type libido.

There is also something else that has been going on, something very strange. Basically I have been having this major masculine-type dysphoria. I have been feeling so unbelievably masculine lately. I am not sure what caused it. I have mentioned before that one of my fixations about castration is how I would have looked different if it hadn't happened. Lately I have been looking in the mirror and seeing the man I was supposed to be. I have developed a pretty good idea of what I might look like if I hadn't been castrated, and it's like I can see him in the mirror and want him to come out even though what is really staring back at me is this eunuchoid, slightly feminized body. I think maybe for the first time in my life I am finally able to understand what a transsexual experiences. One theory is that the return of the male-type libido is what caused these masculine feelings. With that libido now being gone, we'll have to see if those feelings stick around. I still think that I should have been a woman, but, at least when I identify as male, I recognize that I am just a man who thinks he should have been one rather than actually being a woman.

This is one of those times when I am definitely identifying as male. Sure, I am a weird, feminine-like male, but I am still undeniably male. Of course it wasn't that long ago that I felt I couldn't be male, and not long before that when I felt as I do now. I think it's clear that these shifts in gender identity and hormonal preferences are ongoing for me. I am also thinking that maybe any one way of thinking about this may not be any more "right" than any other way. It may not be "right" for me to be on T, on nothing, or on E. Perhaps sometimes I just feel like taking T, while at other times I feel like taking E. Maybe I really am genderfluid or hormonefluid, if there is such a thing.

Now even though I would be lying if I said I hadn't considered going back on T (I in fact received a prescription for it from my doctor and am just a fill away from taking it again), I know in my heart that it wouldn't be the right thing to do. I remember exactly why I stopped taking it, and I remember how I felt about that decision. I wasn't thrilled about it, but I knew it was what I needed to do. Over this last year or so I have learned that the eunuch life has many wonderful things to offer and that my new role may be something to celebrate rather than mourn.

Of course there are downsides to being a eunuch, and it is these that trouble me so when I think about staying hormone-free forever. How will I stand the lack of energy and feeling utterly exhausted? The poor memory? The sleeplessness? The lack of motivation? The physical dysphoria, if it continues? It would be so much easier to take hormones, but I don't suppose that the easy path is the one filled with the greatest rewards.

[tugon (imported)]

I always enjoy reading your posts. My greatest wish for you is one day you can find where you are happiest on the male to female continuum. There is peace in being your genuine self and one day you will have the answer.